85 Turismo... Fuel Injection?

[Skligmund]

Okay, here is the deal. I'd like to make my 85 Turismo H.O. (high compression 2.2 carb) manual trans a daily driver until I have the funds to do a proper job on the car and make it nice.

It seems I have a couple options to make this car run good and get good fuel mileage. Mind you, I live in Alaska, where turbos are NOT everywhere, and anything ordered will have insane shipping involved.

On a fairly regular basis, I see late 80's, early 90's Shadows, Sundances and the like for sale cheap (say 200-800 bucks). Some have toast engines, others have toast trannies, some are even drivable. For around 300 bucks, I could put a weber on my car, and not have to change much, but still have to deal with a carb (and the choke, winter being what it is). My car has no A/C or cruise.

So here are my options as I see it (with limited knowledge, so tell me where I am wrong, and anything else helpful)

1. Buy Weber carb, install, monkey with jets, choke, figure out what to do with vacuum lines and make the throttle cable work.

2. Buy an entire MOPAR 2.2 or 2.5 fuel injected M/T car, remove entire engine assembly, Transmission, wiring harness, computer ect, and install in my car (trans and throttle linkages might be an issue? Some cars better than others for this? Places to plug in these wires?)

3. Same as the 2 above but keep my transmission (525)

4. Same as #2, but only use the fuel system and the wiring harness/computer

5. Same as #3, but only use the fuel system and the wiring harness/computer

6. Any version of above but from a yard (assuming availability)


That is what I see. The likelihood of me finding a good turbo car up here for cheap is low to say the least. I want to drive my Turismo, but it isn't drivable now. What kind of issues will I be looking at? Is this a straight forward operation, or are there fabrication items involved? Are there cars best suited for this, or will anything work (acclaim, daytona, dynasty, new yorker ect?). How about manufacture dates? Does the Fuel Inj. cars care about what transmission is installed? Will the fuel inj. system handle my engine okay?

I foresee in the next couple years some real time put into this car, and it turned into a very nice ride, but my money situation could be better right now, and I just need this car going reliably. For the moment, I'm not after any more power or such things, but I really do prefer to drive this car, not something else. My wife and I love to drive it (so much fun, even without a turbo).

Thanks guys, any help is greatly appreciated.

I'll show you an example of a Fuel inj. car I am looking at. It has an auto trans:

http://anchorage.craigslist.org/for/1608744317.html

much cheaper than a new carb...

[supercrackerbox]

Truly honestly, I'd say find one of those running driving beaters and drive it and beat it. Repeat as needed. Daily driving a vehicle that you plan to restore is often an oxymoron, especially in inclimate weather. I've had that delusion before, it wasn't pretty.

[Skligmund]

The unfortunate truth is I want to drive the Turismo. Restored or not. I just need the damn thing to run reliably. I have a Ford Ranger as my primary transportation. The car is rusty around the wheel wells, so any driving I'm going to do to it in the next couple years won't hurt it more than it will be sitting outside under some trees.

The other reason I don't buy throw away cars is the nickel and dime crap to make it run proper when it is first acquired, and the registration that goes along with it.

I don't want to restore while I drive, if that is what you were getting at. I DO want the 30+ MPG that I got with it when it did run. And the pure enjoyment of driving it.

[minigts]

Dude, I found an IROC R/T in Anchorage, so keep looking for something to donate for your car. There was a GLHS up there for sale last year. I was going to buy it, but someone beat me to it. Keep looking and you'll find a donor. :)

[black86glhs]

Here is the issue. You don't have a LM onyour car now, correct? If you go TBI, you will need the engine bay harness, LM, and run the harness into the pass compartment.
It will stay carbed, but the Weber carb would be an easier setup and be less hassle, IMHO. The choke can be adjusted so it works correctly.

[1FastCSX289]

Here is the issue. You don't have a LM onyour car now, correct? If you go TBI, you will need the engine bay harness, LM, and run the harness into the pass compartment.
It will stay carbed, but the Weber carb would be an easier setup and be less hassle, IMHO. The choke can be adjusted so it works correctly.

+1^ If youre looking for as little screwing around as possible, just get the carb to run correctly. THey can be reliable. I heard. ;)

[Skligmund]

Just not the carb that is on it as far as I can tell. See if I can come up with a weber cheap.

Okay, well, I just found a 92 Sundance 2 door America I might just drive for the time being, we'll see.

http://alaskaslist.com/1/posts/10_Transportation/37_Automobiles/67299_1992_Plymouth_Sundance_2_Door.html

[TopDollar69]

I would try to find an 89 Omni or Horizon if you want the easiest parts for a TBI conversion on your Turismo.

[Skligmund]

Yeah, I'm always looking for more l bodies.... if I find one I'll et you all know.

There is a 1985 New Yorker 2.2 Turbo car for sale up here....

[BadAssPerformance]

Here is the issue. You don't have a LM onyour car now, correct? If you go TBI, you will need the engine bay harness, LM, and run the harness into the pass compartment.
It will stay carbed, but the Weber carb would be an easier setup and be less hassle, IMHO. The choke can be adjusted so it works correctly.

Maybe he's not acrificing a large enough animal to the carb gods? :confused2:


Just not the carb that is on it as far as I can tell. See if I can come up with a weber cheap.

Okay, well, I just found a 92 Sundance 2 door America I might just drive for the time being, we'll see.

http://alaskaslist.com/1/posts/10_Transportation/37_Automobiles/67299_1992_Plymouth_Sundance_2_Door.html

Nice driver there... any 1st gen neons for that price range? Better gas mileage for same cash is always nice, easier to find parts for these days.


As for fuel injection on the Turismo... I would recommend running '87 turbo electronics and fuel system... even without the turbo, the MPFI would run very well... the only question you would have to ask is "why dont you put the turbo on too?" :evil:

[Skligmund]

Main reason? Turbo (especially up here) = premium price. I can keep my exhaust for fuel injection, I can keep my trashmission... Turbos just open up another can that I don't want right now.

So an 87 L body turbo setup would be ideal? Or would any other 87 system work in the car?

[BadAssPerformance]

Premium? as in premium fuel?

87 L would be easiest as the harness would fit in.. other bodies are different.

[Skligmund]

Premium as in higher price

[BadAssPerformance]

Premium as in higher price

It is here too... wait, I thought gas was free up by you? ;)

[ScottD]

The easiest thing to do is to get a Weber 32/36 DFEV carb. I got one for $269 from webercarbsdirect. You can easily swap carbs on a Saturday, spend Sunday dialing the car in and be done.

Check out my Project Log on my Turismo in the project log section here. The Weber is straight forward to install. I can walk you through it if you are hesitant about it. The choke is adjustable. You will have to dial the carb in once it is on there, but that is not a big deal, it is just setting the choke, setting the fast idle, setting the base idle and adjusting the air/fuel mix. The linkage is easy, you just adapt the linkage arm from the Holley carb.

I drive my Turismo regularly, I drive it to work usually 3 times a week. I just put it on the road in January and am closing in on 1,000 miles on it already. It runs great with the Weber on it.

The gas mileage has been around 24, but I do have a ported head on mine with oversized valves. I'm also not sure about whether I could downsize the jets, it runs a little rich at WOT right now. I'm not touching the jets though until I put a 2.25 exhaust on it though and see how that affects things. I also have a 180 deg thermostat in it that I might put back to 195. I would like to get the MPG in the upper 20s.

As TopDollar said, the easiest way to convert your Turismo to FI would be to get an 88-89 Omni/Horizon as a parts car because the underhood and dash wiring harnesses would be plug ins. But you'd be doing a TON of work to convert it to FI, including swapping the engine bay and dash harnesses, swapping fuel tanks, swapping fuel lines, pulling the head to swap manifolds. Depending on how fast you work the car would be undriveable for a bit to do all this work.

[Skligmund]

Thanks a lot ScottD. You have lots of good information there.

Here in the next few weeks I think I'll order me up one of them there Weber carbs and just be done with it.

When it come time, I'll probably ask a couple questions. :D

[contraption22]

Look for a like-year minivan or rampage with a non-emission carb. They are much more reliable.

In my experience, my carb'd cars have gotten better milage than TBI cars of the same engine, chassis, and trans.

If you want to go EFI, I would get a megasquirt system that runs fuel-only. Use the OE puter to run the ignition. There is a guy from the Allpar board that did this with a late-T1 intake manifold to his turismo and gets 35+mpg with it.

[ScottD]

Look for a like-year minivan or rampage with a non-emission carb. They are much more reliable.

In my experience, my carb'd cars have gotten better milage than TBI cars of the same engine, chassis, and trans.

If you want to go EFI, I would get a megasquirt system that runs fuel-only. Use the OE puter to run the ignition. There is a guy from the Allpar board that did this with a late-T1 intake manifold to his turismo and gets 35+mpg with it.

+1 the 5220 non-feedback carbs are supposedly less finicky. Contact Steve_In_VA, he has a reman Holley 5220 for sale that I just looked at this weekend which would be another option for you other than the Weber. I read so many positive things about the Weber though that was the direction I decided to go in. I also liked the fact the Weber is mechanical and not vacuum secondary which the Holley is.

Also, do you have emissions in AK? I have all my emissions stuff removed which eliminates the majority of the vacuum lines. This helps simplify things. I've read that bits of charcoal from the canister can get sucked into the Holley and goof things up.

[Skligmund]

Well, Alaska has no emissions, but the Municipality of Anchorage does. I'm certain I can register my Turismo outside of the muni (I have resources available to me), so I'll be ripping off most of the emissions garbage when I rid myself of the 6520.

I'd like to get a 5220 carb, but I've heard that they are about the most difficult carbs to rebuild (and run correctly) and tend not to work 4 out of 5 times. At least this is what I've gathered via other posts and other forums... 5220 is nice because it looks original on the car if the emissions guy isn't familiar with the setup (and the sticker is not very legible).

We'll see. I should be starting my new job in the next week or so, so it will still be a couple weeks before I have the funds to tackle this anyways.

I swear fixing airplanes is way easier than autos.

[Skligmund]

Oh, as for the mega squirt, I didn't realize you could use it for fuel only. I've been eying it, but making the ignition work had always kinda scared me.

Another question:

Are all 2.2 distributers alike, or are the turbo ones different (or FI ones for that matter). how about between years? I'm questioning the goodness of my distributer, and figuring out which one I need (if I can get one out of a yard ect).

[ScottD]

I'd read the same things about the 5220 being difficult to rebuild.

The Weber really doesn't look much different than the 5220. In fact, Weber lists the 32/36 DFEV as a replacement for the 5220. Unless the emissions inspector is into carb'd L bodies I highly doubt they'd notice :-)


Well, Alaska has no emissions, but the Municipality of Anchorage does. I'm certain I can register my Turismo outside of the muni (I have resources available to me), so I'll be ripping off most of the emissions garbage when I rid myself of the 6520.

I'd like to get a 5220 carb, but I've heard that they are about the most difficult carbs to rebuild (and run correctly) and tend not to work 4 out of 5 times. At least this is what I've gathered via other posts and other forums... 5220 is nice because it looks original on the car if the emissions guy isn't familiar with the setup (and the sticker is not very legible).

We'll see. I should be starting my new job in the next week or so, so it will still be a couple weeks before I have the funds to tackle this anyways.

I swear fixing airplanes is way easier than autos.