1st gear locking up A-413

[Reeves]

Any one got ideas on this?

Driving to work one day in my van and I noticed it wasn't going into 2nd gear. Just going from 1st to 3rd. If you manually put it in 2nd, it would just free rev.

Got back home and adjusted the front band. That fixed 2nd, but then I noticed reverse wasn't working.

Removed valve body and the rear band was WAAY out of adjustment. I mean a crap load. Lock nut was still tight. So wtf? Adjusted it (almost ran out of adjustment screw) and put it all back together.

Park, reverse, 3rd, and 2nd all work now...but when you put it in 1st gear, it's like you are standing on the brakes anytime you hit the gas. The wheels just lock up the more gas you give it. If it idles, the wheels will turn a little.

Any ideas?

[R/T]

Park, reverse, 3rd, and 2nd all work now...but when you put it in 1st gear, it's like you are standing on the brakes anytime you hit the gas. The wheels just lock up the more gas you give it. If it idles, the wheels will turn a little.

Any ideas?

Transbrake??? :eyebrows:

[turbovanman²]

You probably over tightened the rear band, its supposed to have a crapload of adjustment, :eyebrows:

The front band adjustment is snug down, back off 1.5 turns, rear band is snug and back off 3-4 turns.

The reason the bands get loose is durrrr, the bands wear or the drums wear so periodically, they need adjusting. Also, the rear band strut is very weak, its thin metal and bends over time, hence Sonnax making a nice, HD unit to stop that. I've almost bent the stockers over, they come out looking like the letter C, :eyebrows:

[Reeves]

You probably over tightened the rear band, its supposed to have a crapload of adjustment, :eyebrows:

The front band adjustment is snug down, back off 1.5 turns, rear band is snug and back off 3-4 turns.

The reason the bands get loose is durrrr, the bands wear or the drums wear so periodically, they need adjusting. Also, the rear band strut is very weak, its thin metal and bends over time, hence Sonnax making a nice, HD unit to stop that. I've almost bent the stockers over, they come out looking like the letter C, :eyebrows:

This trans was recently rebuilt. Not blaming the builder at all, just wondering how it went from a perfectly good working trans, to both bands out of adjustment at the same time?

Also, I adjusted both bands the exact way you described above.

Any other ideas?

[turbovanman²]

This trans was recently rebuilt. Not blaming the builder at all, just wondering how it went from a perfectly good working trans, to both bands out of adjustment at the same time?

Also, I adjusted both bands the exact way you described above.

Any other ideas?

You shouldn't run out of adjuster-rear band, it seems like that when you tighten it up but then backing it off gives you lots of screw.

What does it do in manual 1st? It could be the rear band isn't working properly. In first, the rear clutch is on, but that's also in all gears, in manual first, the rear band is applied so if its fine in manual first, the sprag is damaged, aka the one way clutch which means a full tear down.

[Reeves]

You shouldn't run out of adjuster-rear band, it seems like that when you tighten it up but then backing it off gives you lots of screw.

What does it do in manual 1st? It could be the rear band isn't working properly. In first, the rear clutch is on, but that's also in all gears, in manual first, the rear band is applied so if its fine in manual first, the sprag is damaged, aka the one way clutch which means a full tear down.

I’m not sure what you are trying to say in the 2nd paragraph.

I’m doing all this testing on my lift (wheels off the ground). If I put the trans in Drive, it starts off in 2nd gear, then shifts to 3rd. If I manually put it in 2nd, it stays in 2nd. If I manually put it in 2nd, and then shift to 3rd, it goes to 3rd. If I manually put it in 1st, the wheels slow way down and sometimes even stop. If I tap the gas, the wheels stop. If I hold the gas down, the wheels stay stopped, the boost starts coming up, I get that real cool whistle in the garage as if I was standing on the brakes and coming up on the convertor, but I’m not on the brakes!

I just had another idea. Maybe something happened to the trans BEFORE I adjusted the bands, and that is why I HAD to adjust the bands. Like maybe it started doing this before and it wore the bands out. Now that I have them adjusted again, the problem is REALLY showing up now. ??

[turbovanman²]

Start off in manual 1st-aka put the lever in 1st, what happens?

Then put it in D, what happens?

[Reeves]

Start off in manual 1st-aka put the lever in 1st, what happens?


If I manually put it in 1st, the wheels slow way down and sometimes even stop.


Then put it in D, what happens?


If I put the trans in Drive, it starts off in 2nd gear, then shifts to 3rd.

:confused2:

[Captain Chaos]

Cindy's running a 5 speed special.

[Reeves]

Seriously thinking about it! Need to find pedals, shifter, etc.

[Captain Chaos]

Seriously thinking about it! Need to find pedals, shifter, etc.

I have P body pedals and a 523 shifter if it helps.

[turbovanman²]

Somehow I missed what you said earlier?????? :banghead:

Anyhow, to me, you have a governor issue and maybe the rear sprag is acting up.

[csxtra]

just wondering how it went from a perfectly good working trans, to both bands out of adjustment at the same time?


Do you think it could be from accelerated wear due to a rear brake caliper dragging so much that it turned a chrome wheel blue?:eyebrows:

[TurboJerry]

Sounds like the rear band is too tight... The governor will need to be cleaned also. If it has a kevlar rear band it might have tore off some of the lining which would explain the crazy adjustment... I do 1 turn on the front band, & 3 on the rear. Just snug on the adj. screws or 72 inlbs. if you have an inlbs torque wrench the back off the required amount. I nursed a few trans with bad rear bands for months before taking them apart to fix the problem... Or the rear band might of cooked from being too tight ???

[Reeves]

Do you think it could be from accelerated wear due to a rear brake caliper dragging so much that it turned a chrome wheel blue?:eyebrows:

I seriously don't think it was the rear caliper anymore. When I pulled it in the garage this time to start working on it it did the EXACT same thing as if the rear brakes were locked...I checked them this time...they roll nice and free!

Makes sense since I thought when the caliper was hanging that it would have scooted the ONE wheel from a stop and it didn't.

Granted, the caliper was hanging some.....I'll give you that. But sh*T!


Sounds like the rear band is too tight... The governor will need to be cleaned also. If it has a kevlar rear band it might have tore off some of the lining which would explain the crazy adjustment... I do 1 turn on the front band, & 3 on the rear. Just snug on the adj. screws or 72 inlbs. if you have an inlbs torque wrench the back off the required amount. I nursed a few trans with bad rear bands for months before taking them apart to fix the problem... Or the rear band might of cooked from being too tight ???

That's how I did the rear band. Snugged (loosely) and then backed off about 3.25 turns.

I think I have a bone stock valve body somewhere. Maybe I'll put that in to see what it does.

[TurboJerry]

That's how I did the rear band. Snugged (loosely) and then backed off about 3.25 turns.

I think I have a bone stock valve body somewhere. Maybe I'll put that in to see what it does.

Could be a VB problem, but *really* sounds like a governor problem if it's taking off in 2nd/3rd gear...

[ohiorob]

for the bands to need that much ajustment something is wearing them out. try the valve body body if that don't do it you will have to pull the tranny.

[black86glhs]

James, it sounds like a VB problem. It sounds like it is trying to apply 1st and reverse at the same time. I don't recall a governer causing it to lock up first and not move, will it?
Maybe a valve is hung up?

[turbors89]

Have the same problem with my car but it will only lock up on occasion. Have had it apart three times to clean the governor and clean the valve body, works for a little then back to normal. Every time ive taken it apart the governor was seriously hard to move back and forth.

[R/T]

I think I have a bone stock valve body somewhere. Maybe I'll put that in to see what it does.

I have about 3 if you need one.... :p

[turbovanman²]

Have the same problem with my car but it will only lock up on occasion. Have had it apart three times to clean the governor and clean the valve body, works for a little then back to normal. Every time ive taken it apart the governor was seriously hard to move back and forth.

Put the repair kit in and if you keep messing it up, try running an magnetic filter on your cooler line. Sounds like your trans is ready to go.

[22shelby]

i get the same thing on cold run liuke when i first pull out of my drive way.

once it warms up shes good to go. i think my issue is the type of fluid im running.... ive got type F in mine. like i said its fine once it warms up. i do how ever have an issue of it not kicking back into first gear upon a stop... so i drop the shifter down in1st then back to D and it shifts fine...... idk i dont really care... when it comes time to get down the trans works. i meen 13.2 on a stock trans w/ the VB mod..... 160k trans.... if it blows ive got back ups so.

but i would like to know what its doing when it does the "lockup". i know what ur feeling too, it feels like ur riding the brakes HARD!! but also noticed it only did it in 1st and not in drive.... i also notice when its could she dont like to shift in 2nd... but once it warms up abit it shifts and works...

i think alot of my issue is fluid at this point... if im not mistaken type F is a thicker oil than say +4-+3 dexIII... the colder it got outside the worse it got...


im keepin a eye on this thread

[turbovanman²]

The fluid isn't your problem.

You have a bad governor, maybe a valve body issue or its just worn out.

[Reeves]

Alright...did some playing with it today.

Went up to my barn and found three auto trans. All of them had lock up connectors on the front. I didn't know if there was a difference in the valve body's or not. Decided to grab one of them anyway.

Came home and pulled my valve body out. Noticed the only thing that looked different was the solenoid. Pulled the solenoid off and put the cover from my valve body on the newer 93 valve body. Also noticed that the 93 valve body had 2 springs when I removed the solenoid, my valve body only had one. So I put both springs in the 93.

Also noticed there is a plunger that hangs out with a spring and c-clip on both valve bodies. The 93 valve body plunger moved very freely. My valve body's plunger thing is either froze solid, or does not move.

Put it all back together. Exact same thing in 1st gear.

Re-set the front band. Snug, then backed off 1.5 turns. Same thing in 1st gear.

Backed off front band about 3 turns. Seems first gear is working.

Took it out for a ride.

Reverse works, but isn't right. You put it in reverse and it really doesn't do anything until you give it gas....then all of a sudden you get a little bam, and it starts backing up. If you stop, you have to rev it up again until you get the bam, and then it backs up again.

Put it in drive and it usually starts off in 2nd gear. 1 time it did start in 1st and felt normal, but then it just started off in 2nd from then on out. Manually put it in 1st from a stop and you have to rev it up until you get a bam, then it takes off in 1st....kind of like reverse.

Am I screwed?

[turbovanman²]

Not sure what to say, :(

Mine has the same reverse issue from time to time after I put it back together this summer, its worse after it sits for a few days. I think my low/rev servo is leaking.

It won't help you but I'll be going thru it in January/Feb.

[iceman.kcmo]

I just rebuilt my trans back in november. I have the normal gov issues which will be fixed by the sonnax govener kit. But I Just started having this problem this morning.

I go to pull out of the driveway, its uphill in reverse, and i always have to give it a little gas with the 2.60 gears. I go to put it in Manual 1st and it feels like im putting the brakes on. Maybe the front band is still engaged? I dont know. It worked perfect last night.

Any Ideas?

[iceman.kcmo]

I found another thread that might be related?
http://www.turbo-mopar.com/forums/showthread.php?t=3368&highlight=a413+reverse

[iceman.kcmo]

I dont know if you fixed this problem, but it was a Cracked Accumulator for me. Replaced with a new one, and fixed the problem..

Check it out if you haven't already.

[TurboJerry]

I forgot almost all the late model trans come with the plastic accumulator pistons... I always put the early aluminum ones in with a spacer instead of putting plugs in the case so the forward pressure readings can still be easily read... That would cause the front band and direct clutch to come on together which would give the dragging feeling or lock it up in forward gears if it cracks badly enough.

[iceman.kcmo]

Yeah, mine had a big Chunk of it that dropped out when i took it out..

[turbovanman²]

That's why you just block the accumulator off, never have to worry about this stuff, :nod:

[Reeves]

That's why you just block the accumulator off, never have to worry about this stuff, :nod:

Did you leave the accumulator in when you blocked it off? I'm thinking I took all the guts out, then blocked the holes on a project car I built a while back. Can't remember for sure.

[turbovanman²]

Took the guts out, more places for fluid to hide.

[Reeves]

It was the accumulator broke, according to Rob.

[RoadWarrior222]

Oh, the reverse banging is meant to be common to all torqueflites and derivatives. It's supposed to be due to the line pressure being lower in park, so when you go straight from P to R it hasn't got enough pressure at first then slams in when it does. Apparently the "cure" is to move to N for a couple of seconds first.

[turbovanman²]

I have the cure from Turbo Jerry, just have to make the article up.