bulk head swap problems

[kuzman83]

I just bought an 89 daytona harness to put in my shelby lancer and after re-doing the headlight wiring I noticed that the bulkheads are different. The pin outs are identical but on the daytona harness the bulkhead is all female connectors and on the 87 shelby the pins are all male ends. Does anyone know a reasonably quick fix for this or am I going to have to change 60 ends to male ends?

[rbryant]

Get female harness from a turbo lancer/lebaron gts or caravan that has the female connector on the engine side. :)

Or you can get just get the connector and splice/solder them one by one. I wouldn't recommend that unless you are good with a solder iron and know what you are doing. It can be done though I have made a couple of S60 lbody harnesses by cutting and soldering.

-Rich

[GLHNSLHT2]

yep in 88 they reversed sexes of the plugs on Gbodies. Stupid IMO. But I got a spare 87 bulkhead connector and cut and spliced all the wires onto my 88 harness. Turned out great, looks stock and no bugs. But was over 8hrs of work double checking all the wires locations and then soldering and shrink wrapping it all.

[kuzman83]

unfortunately thats what i figured you were going to say haha. I am, if i do say so myself, pretty handy with a soldering iron and shrink wrap. I think what I am going to do is solder an 87 head on to the 89 harness but I would really like to add crusie control to my car so I am going to re-locate the bulk head to the inside of the car and use the circular rubber gromet and fit it into the square hole on the fire wall. From the other threads i have read the 2 or 3 extra plugs on the G body harness by the bulk head are for cruise and an antenna or something. Any other suggestions you guys might have would be great.

[minigts]

You should be able to get the pin connectors through Dorman. Check their site, scour their electrical section and find the part number. Then you can locate a dealer who carries them. You may get lucky and find a retailer that carries them, but they will be about $1 a PIECE. A LOOOONG time ago I found a wholesaler out of PA that sold me the ones for the L bodies for about .20 cents a piece. That is what I would do instead of cutting, soldering and what not.

[kuzman83]

what pin connectors are you referring to? something like a connector with 2 male ends?

[iTurbo]

I had the same issue when I tried to put an '88 Lancer Shelby harness into my '87 Shelby Lancer. They had the same sex plugs so they would not plug together and the bulkhead was relocated under the dash. Chryco probably did it for better resistance to weather and the elements but yes, frustrating. I had originally planned to make a gender changer adapter, but it would have been too bulky and interfered with the clutch cable bracket on the strut tower.

So instead of using the '88 LS harness, I went and got a '91 GTC harness instead since I had to modify the bulkhead anyway. I figured I might as well go SBEC instead and the '91 GTC harness has that cool power distribution box too. I simply cut off the female bulkhead off the GTC harness and spliced on the male bulkhead from the SL harness. Tedious, but worked great and very straightforward. The pinout was hardly any different other than option content between the vehicles.

I had a similar problem when I installed an '89 turbo Caravan harness into my GLH Turbo back in '04. In that case, the bulkhead was the right sex, but the L-body used a 40-pin while the Caravan used a similar (but incompatible) 50-pin bulkhead connector. I made an adapter to get around this, which is kinda cool because you can modify the pinout to suit your needs without touching the underhood harness or underdash harness. It did interfere with the clutch cable bracket somewhat though.

http://www.turbosedan.com/jerm/imcarpix/adpater1.jpg

[minigts]

what pin connectors are you referring to? something like a connector with 2 male ends?

Well I'm assuming you have a 50 pin connector in the car with say female pins and a wiring harness that has a 50 pin connector with female pins as well. I'm suggesting locating the comparable male pins and re-terminating the engine harness with the male pins so it just clips in. Of course, you'll need the black connector that houses the male pins, but I'm sure someone has those. Personally that is what I would do.

[iTurbo]

^If you can find those terminals, I agree that's probably the best way to go and would get you out from under a lot of soldering. Because of the relocated bulklhead, you are probably going to have to trim about 12" off the harness so it's the proper length to plug into the firewall. The bulkhead shell should be easy to find at the junkyard. The terminals are very easy to unclip from the shell once you remove the foam gasket and rubber boot.

[GLHNSLHT2]

unfortunately thats what i figured you were going to say haha. I am, if i do say so myself, pretty handy with a soldering iron and shrink wrap. I think what I am going to do is solder an 87 head on to the 89 harness but I would really like to add crusie control to my car so I am going to re-locate the bulk head to the inside of the car and use the circular rubber gromet and fit it into the square hole on the fire wall. From the other threads i have read the 2 or 3 extra plugs on the G body harness by the bulk head are for cruise and an antenna or something. Any other suggestions you guys might have would be great.

I kept the Cruise Control wiring while still going through the bulkhead connector setup.

[kuzman83]

ok i've searched everywhere for an 89 bulkhead pin out diagram for a daytona and i cant find one. the one link in the sticky thread about looking for harnesses doesn't work. does anyone have a 1989 dodge daytona T2 bulkhead pin out they could post here?

[minigts]

ok i've searched everywhere for an 89 bulkhead pin out diagram for a daytona and i cant find one. the one link in the sticky thread about looking for harnesses doesn't work. does anyone have a 1989 dodge daytona T2 bulkhead pin out they could post here?

I'll post pics when I get home. If you don't see anything posted by about 8pm CST, call me at 901.240.9059.

[kuzman83]

i forgot to call you so i will call tonight if i don't see it posted sometime today.

[minigts]

I forgot to do it. :( Let me get my manual and I'll get it in now. Sorry about that.

[minigts]

Here are the two pages in the service manual for the bulkhead. If you need the original image files, the large resolution ones, just let me know. It will be later today before I can get that done.

EDIT: Nevermind, they are uploaded along with some 93 diagrams to www.minigts.com/servicemanual/89_Diagrams/wiring and www.minigts.com/servicemanual/93_Diagrams/wiring. Some of the images were bad, so I intend to get them reshot, but I need to keep the file names as this is my naming convention for the year, page number and what it is. I'm still making updates, so don't knock my current inconsistent system. Eventually it will be. :)

EDIT: I've updated the links and organized the files. I'm in the process of weeding out the files that don't work. Hopefully I will have the entire 2.2 G body wiring diagrams completed by the end of this week.

[kuzman83]

haha no knocks from me, thanks a ton for the help. I'll let you in on what's going on with my car, it's a real treat lol. I purchased an 89 daytona harness to put in my 87 shelby lancer. I changed the sex on the bulk head and got it installed into the car, hooked a few things up and here's what happened.

*pull the headlight switch, the interior lights come on.
*try to turn on the brights and the interior lights go off.
*with the door open, the interior lights do not come on unless the headlight switch is on, however with the headlight switch on and the door closed the interior lights go off.
*none of the exterior lights work with the headlights turned on.
*and the message center always says that the drivers door is open and that the bright lights are on.

The only thing that I thought i didn't have figured out was which set of ignition switch wires to use. the 89 harness comes with the ignition switch wires wired into the engine harness that comes through the firewall. however the 87 harness that is in my car has the ignition switch wires wired into the instrument panel circuits. I experienced all these problems with the wires from the 87 harness plugged into the ignition switch. I did not try to switch to the 89 harness plugs but I'm struggling to figure out how having the wrong set of ignition switch wires plugged in would affect interior lights and the message center. I realize that I'm kind of in no mans land so i'm not expecting anyone to solve my problem for me, that being said, two heads are better than one.

[minigts]

I went through your pains a few years ago. If you need some help, just give me a call. I'm working today and have some things to do after work, but call me later if you need some info. I was afraid to start the car, but everything worked out fine. :)

[kuzman83]

well i'm going to work on it tonight so you'll probably be getting a phone call. this is my last week of being able to horse around with it before school starts back up again.

[minigts]

As an FYI, I'm also uploading some images for the 85 LMZ diagrams to the following location.

http://www.minigts.com/servicemanual/85_Diagrams/wiring/LMZ_Diagrams/ If I make any changes to the folder structure above, which I more than likely will, I will be sure to update. If all else fails, navigate to the root directory of http://www.minigts.com/servicemanual to see all the available manuals uploaded.

[rbryant]

As an FYI, I'm also uploading some images for the 85 LMZ diagrams to the following location.

http://www.minigts.com/servicemanual/85_Diagrams/wiring/LMZ_Diagrams/ If I make any changes to the folder structure above, which I more than likely will, I will be sure to update. If all else fails, navigate to the root directory of http://www.minigts.com/servicemanual to see all the available manuals uploaded.

Do you have the older lbody manuals? Mike Marra and I want to confirm that the '82/83, etc 40 pin bulkhead is indeed the same as the 85+ 40 pin bulkhead.

I am very confident that they are from memory but I don't have the manuals to prove it.

This is to verify that the S60 style harness works on all 40 pin lbody bulkheads.

Thanks,

Rich

[kuzman83]

ok i have officially given up. the daytona harness just will not work in my lancer. I studied the wiring diagrams, double checked to make sure i had the wires in the right spots on the bulk head and it just isn't working. So sometime soon i'm going to head to my brothers place and snag the harness out of a wrecked lancer shelby at the junk yard. I'll probably grab the interior harness too. I'm planning on restoring my shelby lancer as soon as i graduate so i guess i'll just use this time to hoard parts in preparation.

[rbryant]

ok i have officially given up. the daytona harness just will not work in my lancer. I studied the wiring diagrams, double checked to make sure i had the wires in the right spots on the bulk head and it just isn't working. So sometime soon i'm going to head to my brothers place and snag the harness out of a wrecked lancer shelby at the junk yard. I'll probably grab the interior harness too. I'm planning on restoring my shelby lancer as soon as i graduate so i guess i'll just use this time to hoard parts in preparation.

I have an 89 GTS harness somewhere but I can't remember what kind of shape it is in. I can probably fix it up (solder/shrink wrap in new wire where needed) if you don't find anything. That harness should bolt in.

I am busy for a while with my car but in a month or two I can do it.

I agree that trying to swap in a daytona harness isn't worth it.

-Rich

[minigts]

Do you have the older lbody manuals? Mike Marra and I want to confirm that the '82/83, etc 40 pin bulkhead is indeed the same as the 85+ 40 pin bulkhead.

I am very confident that they are from memory but I don't have the manuals to prove it.

This is to verify that the S60 style harness works on all 40 pin lbody bulkheads.

Thanks,

Rich

Dag nabbit. I thought I responded to this, but I guess I never finished typing out what I wanted to and then closed the window. :(

My short answer is no I don't have anything prior to 85. I will say that there are 35 cavities out of the 40 that are used and 24 of those are common wires like turn signals, oil sending unit, water temp, cruise control, etc. This leaves only 11 critical wires that are related to ignition and other specific feeds like the 1.6 alternator feed wire. So my guess is they will be very similar if not identical with where the wires go. But even if they weren't, moving wires would be easy.

[kuzman83]

cool, let me know what you want for it when you get it all done, the only problem is that the sex of the bulkheads were changed in 88 so i would have to change the pins on either my interior harness or the gts harness you have. but i just went through and changed all the pins on that daytona harness so it would plug into my interior harness....at least that part was successful.

[minigts]

So you aren't getting power or what is going on? I know it's not the easiest thing to do, but since these cars are all very similar, with a little patience you should be able to get this to work. The only REAL tricky ones will be the fuse links, but tracing those out should yield good results. Believe me man, I feel your pain though.

[kuzman83]

well i'm getting power, and all the under hood relays are working, fuel pump kicks on, starter relay is clicking etc. the problem is all interior related. when i power it up the instrument cluster says that the brights are on, even when they are not. The door lights come on with the headlight switch being pulled out. and the navigator comes on when i turn the windshield wipers on. I did make some progress today, i got my tail lights and headlights to work when turned on, and my power mirrors to work. but the door locks do not work, neither do the windows and i can't get the blower fan to come on either. All of these problems exist irregardless of which set of ignition wires i have plugged into the ignition switch too. So yeah haha, I think i'm just going to put the lancer shelby harness into the interior and use bryants engine harness. We also have to keep in mind the fact that my car started on fire a while ago due to the starter cable shorting out and melting to the negative battery cable, some of my interior parts stopped working after that happened too. So in short, it's a mess.

[minigts]

Dude, that is so not a big deal. That just means your wires are crossed and you need to uncross them. Seriously, get that figured out. Trace the wires, identify them and start making a list. Take care of each wire one at a time and you'll figure it out.

[kuzman83]

yeah i thought about doing that but its a cool twenty degrees outside, and that happens to be where my car is parked haha. we'll see if i get the motivation to mess with it or not. Either way i really would like to put in the interior harness from the lancer shelby because that has the navigator plug built right in, that and the guy that had the car before me hacked up the radio wires to install some crappy aftermarket unit so it would be nice to start with a fresh unit that someone hasn't already messed up.