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View Full Version : Poll time for cam choice!



turbovanmanČ
05-07-2006, 04:39 PM
I have seen the dyno sheets on TD, know Gary has run 10's on the stock 89 turbo cam but still feel that the Taft cams are not bad. I am running an S1 and feel this is now my cork. I have access to an S2, S3 or should I put the stocker back in. I need to know by Wed or Thursday what you guys think as Friday is drag night again and I am getting closer to my goals.

Remember, this is my daily driver too and I don't want my crappy fuel economy to get any worse either, :eyebrows:

89DaytonaTII
05-07-2006, 04:44 PM
Why don't you just try the stocker out and see what happens, better or worse?

turbovanmanČ
05-07-2006, 05:40 PM
Why don't you just try the stocker out and see what happens, better or worse?

That is an option but getting tired of wrenching on it, bike racing season is here and I need to devote my energy to that so I would like to swap out my cam once, :thumb:

89DaytonaTII
05-07-2006, 06:37 PM
I definitly understand that, but I still think that it'd be worth it.

cordes
05-07-2006, 06:54 PM
If you have acess to all three, I would put the S2 in there and give it a go. If that does not pan out, try the S3.

turbovanmanČ
05-07-2006, 07:04 PM
If you have acess to all three, I would put the S2 in there and give it a go. If that does not pan out, try the S3.

I have access but need to buy them, lol! I would rather just buy the one I need, :p

I read that whole thread again over at TD and my head is spinning even faster now, doh! :confused:

cordes
05-07-2006, 07:10 PM
I have access but need to buy them, lol! I would rather just buy the one I need, :p

I read that whole thread again over at TD and my head is spinning even faster now, doh! :confused:


Sorry, I thought that you had all three of them lying around.

I have heard the idle of the S3, and for a daily, year round driver, I would go with the S2, or stock. Were you not running the stock cam when you were running low 14s back when?

turbomopar87
05-07-2006, 07:19 PM
i vote for the S2.

I have the S1 and just made 236hp and 272lbft on it w/ the stock IC in my shelby Z 2.2. I wanted the S2 for daily driving, but I'm waiting for the new line of cams FWD-P is about to come out with:thumb: Cindy told me the S3 is not recommended for daily driving.

Directconnection
05-07-2006, 07:23 PM
Simon, you need to start back at square one, and then go from there...as sucky as it sounds. I'd personally run the stock computer and stock injectors as well to rule out tuning. Also swap back in the stock cam.


Maybe we need a thread soley on to Simon's tuning problems??? Thread on square one.

Simon, I know you've listed it many times, but give me a rundown of your drivetrain (also, gives you a chance to show off your bench-racing skillz)

What kind of convertor are you running and how old/passes are on it? Gus always mentioned how power would go down over time with a ballooned convertor AND/OR tired fluid. His mph always went back up right after fluid changes. (I know you have fresh fluid...just pointing out things)

ps...how'd it go at the track friday? Didn't see a thread yet of your results...will look now:D

turbovanmanČ
05-07-2006, 07:36 PM
Simon, you need to start back at square one, and then go from there...as sucky as it sounds. I'd personally run the stock computer and stock injectors as well to rule out tuning. Also swap back in the stock cam.


Maybe we need a thread soley on to Simon's tuning problems??? Thread on square one.

Simon, I know you've listed it many times, but give me a rundown of your drivetrain (also, gives you a chance to show off your bench-racing skillz)

What kind of convertor are you running and how old/passes are on it? Gus always mentioned how power would go down over time with a ballooned convertor AND/OR tired fluid. His mph always went back up right after fluid changes. (I know you have fresh fluid...just pointing out things)

ps...how'd it go at the track friday? Didn't see a thread yet of your results...will look now:D

Steve, here's the link-it was my cal after all

http://www.turbo-mopar.com/forums/showthread.php?t=4109

Trans is fresh, with new fluid, converter is a custom high stall-4000 rpm from TCS here in Langley-bought it in 03 so its got 2 years of DDing on it plus around 20 runs on it.

Set up is as follows-

Engine-2.5L bored .020 with JE forged and TS rings, no BS's, balanced and custom windage tray by me.

Head and induction-Swirl with +1 mm stainless valves, PT lifters and 3.3L conical valve springs. Ported by me and finished by a well know head shop and flowed, I seem to remember +25% over stock! Heavily port matched 2 piece lower, upper left alone except for 52mm throttle body. Log header. S1 cam. Bell 725 cfm IC with 2.5 In lower pipes, 3 inch upper pipes-mandrel bent. Custom 3 inch air intake with a custom CAI box made by me, K@N cone filter.

Ignition-Aurora high output coil and module, Aurora wires, BR9ES plugs.

Turbo and Ex-Turbonetics 50trim TO4E, stage III wheel, .63 housing, FM DP, 2.5 inch DP for 3 inches then a full 3 inch mandrel system with a Magnaflow.

Fuel system-custom cal by Shel game, 3 bar, +40's, 255 fuel pump, modified MP tables apparently go to 30 psi.

Trans is modified, 5 clutch packs, high stall-4000 converter, usual goodies and now with an OBX LSD.

So theres my setup. I ran a best of 14.1@95 mph in 03 with same converter, no slicks, street tires, open diff, bone stock engine with mild port job by me, 3 inch ex, Super40 muffler with side pipe, stock cal with +20 injectors and 255 fuel pump, CAI and box, TIII turbo and at 23 ish psi, RX7 turbo II IC and plastic 2 inch IC piping.

So you can see, all that work and I am running the same 1/4 time but at a whopping 2 or so psi less, :confused: At least I know my cal was most of the problem for the last year.

TurboJerry
05-14-2006, 06:20 PM
I know this isn't a trans thread, but the stock converters take alot of punishment before they baloon. The thrust washers is what usually goes long before. The S2 installed at 109 to 110 deg should be good....... In my craziness I'd try all 4 and then heli-coil the towers from all the cam changes. (done this before!)

turbovanmanČ
05-14-2006, 07:12 PM
I have a high stall with torringtons and thicker housing.

The S2 cams rocks, :thumb:

turbovanmanČ
05-24-2006, 04:32 PM
I know this isn't a trans thread, but the stock converters take alot of punishment before they baloon. The thrust washers is what usually goes long before. The S2 installed at 109 to 110 deg should be good....... In my craziness I'd try all 4 and then heli-coil the towers from all the cam changes. (done this before!)

Yeah, I already had to helicoil the valve cover bolts, :censored: Well I guess when I get her running again, I'll try the stocker after I max out the S2.

TurboJerry
05-25-2006, 04:58 AM
I still wonder if the '89 turbo cam is still the best for 20+ lbs boost? Seems like the evidence goes that way. The problem is that each car is going to give different results........

GLHSKEN
05-25-2006, 06:53 AM
LOL And then there's the occasional maniac that runs around trying them all and touting them all... No one we know though ;)

turbovanmanČ
05-25-2006, 12:49 PM
LOL And then there's the occasional maniac that runs around trying them all and touting them all... No one we know though ;)

Ouch, :( :lol:

Hey, at least I am not biased, I post my results, hehehe! So far I have found the S1 as a good street cam, so far, the S2 is looking good. Next is the stocker. Good thing is, my setup doesn't change, just the cam so it really is true back to back.

Yep, TJ, every car/van is different, :banghead:

John B
05-25-2006, 01:14 PM
Hey, go for it! You're saving me a lot of cam swapping and dialing in. I have tried the '89 turbo, '88 turbo, and S-1 so far. I'm not using high boost yet and so far I like the S-1.

turbovanmanČ
05-25-2006, 01:16 PM
Hey, go for it! You're saving me a lot of cam swapping and dialing in. I have tried the '89 turbo, '88 turbo, and S-1 so far. I'm not using high boost yet and so far I like the S-1.

Hahahaa, donations????????

The S-1 is good but high boost it sucks. You've seen how time I dropped with just a cam swap, :nod:

Will Martin
05-25-2006, 04:14 PM
Simon,

Have you thought about trying the new FWDP cams they're offering? Nice to have options....

http://www.turbododge.com/forums/showthread.php?t=116339

turbovanmanČ
05-25-2006, 04:18 PM
You have a short memory my friend.

Rattlesnake
05-25-2006, 04:54 PM
Simon, this is the rule of thumb I follow; a heavy vehicle needs torque than a light one to be propelled forward at a faster rate. In the other hand a lighter vehicle doesn't need much low end torque and can use the horspower more efficient. I put 321whp@5500 and 391wft/lbs@4200 with the 89 stocker :thumb: (stock intake, exhaust man., FM Stage3 head and t3/t4 46trim)

turbovanmanČ
05-25-2006, 08:10 PM
Yep, my rule of thumb also. Thats why I am using the track to test the cams, its cheaper also, :thumb:

Any cam that can get a mini into the 13's or 12's at 3500 lbs is making some serious torque, :amen:

BadAssPerformance
05-25-2006, 08:33 PM
I still wonder if the '89 turbo cam is still the best for 20+ lbs boost? Seems like the evidence goes that way. The problem is that each car is going to give different results........

Yep, and to add to that, +20 psi from which turbo through what intake and head?

GLHSKEN
05-26-2006, 07:24 AM
What about the 87 slider. I have always liked the way my car ran with that. I believe Dennis Doza said that in looking at specs, it was more than likely the best one...

glhs875
05-26-2006, 08:02 AM
What about the 87 slider. I have always liked the way my car ran with that. I believe Dennis Doza said that in looking at specs, it was more than likely the best one...

I always liked the way those cams ran as well!! All I know is with an S3 cam and an SC6152 turbo I made a serious shift of the power to the right. Iam going to have to make some changes to my setup to reap the benefits of it. I know the converter needs more stall in it. I may have to bump up the compression ratio a little also to get back the low end torque I lost. Iam going to try and make it work on a street car. I've felt the potential.

GLHSKEN
05-26-2006, 08:25 AM
I have an '87 wrapped and olied downstairs. If nothing better is around, the car will come up with that and "mystery rockers" (lol sintered units)

BTW, Simon, I can't vote. My choice is not there.

GLHS0658
05-26-2006, 10:12 AM
Since Ken mentioned "slider cams", Anyone like/dislike FM475 or FM505 cams?

Mike

BadAssPerformance
05-26-2006, 11:12 AM
I'm currently running the FM475 in the Z and it seems to work ok. Just picked up a 505 but have not run it yet.

John B
05-26-2006, 12:33 PM
What about the 87 slider. I have always liked the way my car ran with that. I believe Dennis Doza said that in looking at specs, it was more than likely the best one... I have been trying to get the S-60 cam done in a roller for that same reason. People liked the way it ran but it just wouldn't last. They say the S-2 is the same as the S-60 but the specs are quite a bit different. Why not a roller with the '87 timing too? It shouldn't be difficult at all.:)

turbovanmanČ
05-26-2006, 01:19 PM
I have been trying to get the S-60 cam done in a roller for that same reason. People liked the way it ran but it just wouldn't last. They say the S-2 is the same as the S-60 but the specs are quite a bit different. Why not a roller with the '87 timing too? It shouldn't be difficult at all.:)

I've talked to my grinder and he says the S2 is virtually identical to the S60. Its just been changed to roller format thats the only difference so yes, its not 100% but damn close.

Will Martin
05-26-2006, 01:23 PM
You have a short memory my friend.

What do I have a short memory about? I was merely listing the post to show OPTIONS, since your poll listed three cams and there are more available. :rolleyes:

John B
05-26-2006, 04:58 PM
I've talked to my grinder and he says the S2 is virtually identical to the S60. Its just been changed to roller format thats the only difference so yes, its not 100% but damn close.

From Dennis Doza's camshaft page the S-60 is .499"/.499" lift, 260/260 duration 112 centerline. The S-2 is .470"/.450" lift, 270/259 duration 114 centerline. Seems pretty different to me.

BadAssPerformance
05-26-2006, 05:02 PM
From Dennis Doza's camshaft page the S-60 is .499"/.499" lift, 260/260 duration 112 centerline. The S-2 is .470"/.450" lift, 270/259 duration 114 centerline. Seems pretty different to me.

That would depend on if the induction system can flow enough CFM to realize the difference.

Directconnection
05-26-2006, 06:10 PM
What about the 87 slider. I have always liked the way my car ran with that. I believe Dennis Doza said that in looking at specs, it was more than likely the best one...

That's what 5Digits said as well.

GLHSKEN
05-26-2006, 07:28 PM
That's what 5Digits said as well.

WOOO HOOOO:thumb: Back to the future I go!!!

boost geek
05-26-2006, 09:02 PM
87 slider in a 2.2 G head for me!

John B
05-27-2006, 05:41 AM
That would depend on if the induction system can flow enough CFM to realize the difference. Granted, but the post was a response to the mistaken impression that the S-60 and S-2 have essentially the same specs. They don't. The S-60 has considerably more lift and less duration than the S-2 and they have different center lines.

BadAssPerformance
05-27-2006, 08:56 AM
Granted, but the post was a response to the mistaken impression that the S-60 and S-2 have essentially the same specs. They don't. The S-60 has considerably more lift and less duration than the S-2 and they have different center lines.

Yes, you are 100% correct on that, it is very different. I was just adding to that a possible reason why people refer to it as being similar :thumb:

John B
05-27-2006, 09:39 AM
While we are on the subject, has anyone heard any specs on the new FWDP cams yet?

turbovanmanČ
05-27-2006, 12:36 PM
While we are on the subject, has anyone heard any specs on the new FWDP cams yet?


Nope. She probably won't release them, which is smart on her part.