Never overheat again.

[turbovanman²]

I found this stuff on my diesel forum, its made by Evan's, you can run higher engine temps, almost never overheat, run no pressure in your cooling system etc. I just talked to the owner for 30min's, pretty neat stuff. I am going to order some today and do some testing. He mentions because of the heat transfer, you can run lower octane gas which results in more power due to the faster burning gas. Its expensive but so are new/larger custom rads.

He also told me to take off the lower part of the rad cap and just run an overflow tank, so thats ZERO pressure, :wow1: That should mean no waterpump issues, blown hoses etc. Sweet. :D

Links-

http://www.evanscooling.com/catalog/C_npg1.htm

http://www.evanscooling.com/html/npgPls.htm

[86trbolancer]

looks interesting...


keep us updated!!!

[minigts]

Interesting, indeed. Let us know Simon!

[mpgmike]

I've heard alot of good things about Evans, but never tried it. I'd be curious what you feel it does for you.

Mike

[minigts]

Do you want low surface tension or high? Also, what is the surface tension of water? I'm asking because they post the info, but I have no idea if higher or lower is better.

[Greedy]

I'm suprised no one on here hasn't used this before.
Its been around for along time.
I never got to use it,I'm eagerly awaiting your results

http://www.turbododge.com/forums/f4/f15/86781-chemical-coolant.html

[turbovanman²]

I'm suprised no one on here hasn't used this before.
Its been around for along time.
I never got to use it,I'm eagerly awaiting your results

http://www.turbododge.com/forums/f4/f15/86781-chemical-coolant.html

We don't go there so we wouldn't know.

I never knew about it until my diesel site. Luckily we have small cooling systems, diesels have 24-30L systems, yikes, :wow1:

I'll post up full results, I won't change anything but just the coolant and cap.

[minigts]

So what is the deal with not having the standard cap? I mean, are you not suppose to run it or is it is something the guy said you could do?

[contraption22]

Evans coolant has been around for a while. I might use it in a stockish car or daily driver, but for those of us that race, take their cars apart often, it's awfully expensive to replace, and cannot be mixed with water in a pinch.

[turbovanman²]

So what is the deal with not having the standard cap? I mean, are you not suppose to run it or is it is something the guy said you could do?

Because it doesn't need pressure to work, you don't need a pressure cap. Water/antifreeze need pressure to raise the boiling point, this stuff is rated for 370+ deg F.


Evans coolant has been around for a while. I might use it in a stockish car or daily driver, but for those of us that race, take their cars apart often, it's awfully expensive to replace, and cannot be mixed with water in a pinch.

He said to mix it with pure ethylene or prop glycol. I agree, expensive but luckily, we only need 8 L or 2 gallons, :nod:

[minigts]

Because it doesn't need pressure to work, you don't need a pressure cap. Water/antifreeze need pressure to raise the boiling point, this stuff is rated for 370+ deg F.

...other stuff

I understand that, but can you run a regular cap, I guess is my question.

[turbovanman²]

I understand that, but can you run a regular cap, I guess is my question.

Not sure, maybe call them, he was very informative. ;)

[T-Bohn]

hey guys

I have been running this stuff in my Ducati and Aprilia on the race track for years....

you can run standard caps no problem ...the water needs the pressure so that it doesn't boil off. the Evans boils at such a high temp it doesn't need the cap pressure

When i switched I noticed a guage that was slightly higher, carring a little more heat in the system but the theory is that that the really hot places are now not so hot ....basically overall system heat is up a bit (5 degrees) but the important places with really high temps are quenched better.

I really like it because it is race track legal ( cleans up easy ) and when it gets cold it shrinks rather then expanding so no cracked blocks or oh crap i gotta change out the race stuff now that winter is here


In a pinch you can add water to the system.. they will mix but you have to boil it out later. Don't add glycol you can't seperate that out and it is slippery at the track and doesn't clean up very well

I like it

["Top Fuel" Bender]

That stuff is expensive
Stinks (smells burnt) and I thought it was a little thick and slimy
took forever to flush it out of my system to switch back

[minigts]

What's the toxicity of that stuff vs anti-freeze? Not too terribly concerned, but if it's significantly less I would consider changing to it. That and the fact it wouldn't pressurize would be nice.

So question: With the lack of pressure in the system, will there be a vacuum now or something with the pump moving the fluid? Just wondering how that works.

[Juggy]

So question: With the lack of pressure in the system, will there be a vacuum now or something with the pump moving the fluid? Just wondering how that works.

i would have to think no

because the system would need to be completely enclosed to make any type of pressure

[turbovanman²]

What's the toxicity of that stuff vs anti-freeze? Not too terribly concerned, but if it's significantly less I would consider changing to it. That and the fact it wouldn't pressurize would be nice.

So question: With the lack of pressure in the system, will there be a vacuum now or something with the pump moving the fluid? Just wondering how that works.

The fluid doesn't move by pressure, its moves because its a fluid. We need pressure to raise the boiling point of water and antifreeze.



That stuff is expensive
Stinks (smells burnt) and I thought it was a little thick and slimy
took forever to flush it out of my system to switch back

For once, I would disagree, $32 for a gallon jug, makes that $64 to do our cars/vans, which compared to larger rads, oil coolers, bigger fans, ducting etc, this is dirt cheap, :nod:

[Vigo]

well last radiator hose i blew was because of a clogged radiator, not heat=pressure. So its still possible to dump $60 on the ground of course.. but it definitely seems like a cool product and id like to see someone else use it to actually address a cooling problem... thatd be neat.

[minigts]

Toxicity level? Still curious if anyone knows. :)

[turbovanman²]

Non toxic, they are applying to have it certified.

We discussed about the pressure of caps, is to run a low pressure due to the possibility of tweaking a head gasket and blowing coolant everywhere. N/A cars, run a zero cap.

The temp gauge will read as it did before, no magic voodoo here, lol.

I just ordered it, should be here next week, then I will run my van with the new setup, then switch to this stuff with a 7 psi cap and report any differences.

[minigts]

Thanks for the info Simon, sounds good. Looking forward to hearing the results.

[T-Bohn]

yeah it is is really not toxic. I remember something about it being nearly food grade safe

[minigts]

yeah it is is really not toxic. I remember something about it being nearly food grade safe

For me that would be a good reason to go with it. If it's that safe, it should be something we begin to use mainstream for cleanliness. I'm not a tree hugger, but anti-freeze is so toxic, I hate even messing with it on my own car. I have jugs of this stuff I have no idea where to take or what to do with it because I don't know who would.

[GLHNSLHT2]

anti freeze makes a good weed killer :) :lol: You guys really just need to read the webpage. All your questions would of been answered with 10 minutes of reading.

[minigts]

anti freeze makes a good weed killer :) :lol: You guys really just need to read the webpage. All your questions would of been answered with 10 minutes of reading.

Yes, but then we wouldn't get a chance to socialize on T-M.com!

[t3rse]

Propylene glycol is used as a food preservative, and is what is used in "pet safe" antifreeze. There is only one commercial company that I am aware of that sells it, and it is called Sierra and comes from Napa. It is about 15$ a gallon. I don't know what is different between it and what you posted....

[turbovanman²]

Propylene glycol is used as a food preservative, and is what is used in "pet safe" antifreeze. There is only one commercial company that I am aware of that sells it, and it is called Sierra and comes from Napa. It is about 15$ a gallon. I don't know what is different between it and what you posted....

I bet the chemical composition is altered and it won't be pure Propylene glycol.

[Greedy]

well last radiator hose i blew was because of a clogged radiator, not heat=pressure.

How did your radiator become clogged?

[turbovanman²]

How did your radiator become clogged?

They get clogged over due to do mineral/calcium deposits building up.

[Nemesismachine]

http://www.evanscooling.com/main20.htm

Physical Properties of 100% Propylene Glycol
http://www.evanscooling.com/graphics/proptbl3.jpg

And for all those curious, here's the MSDS data.
http://www.evanscooling.com/download/Evans%20MSDS%20NPGplus.pdf

[swiss_daytona]

Don't we have some laboratory workers - or even chem students on the board?
Maybe they could analyze this stuff...

In fact on don't believe in magic/secret formulas, if it was indeed so special, why don't big ones sell stuff like it?

[turbovanman²]

Don't we have some laboratory workers - or even chem students on the board?
Maybe they could analyze this stuff...

In fact on don't believe in magic/secret formulas, if it was indeed so special, why don't big ones sell stuff like it?

COST! Plain and simple. Multiply millions of gallons at say $30 more and you get the picture.

[minigts]

COST! Plain and simple. Multiply millions of gallons at say $30 more and you get the picture.

I think his point is, it's safer, more effective so why aren't using this as a standard instead of anti-freeze which is extremely toxic and has greater limits than this stuff? Unless the elements in this stuff are rare or harder to come by, there is no reason companies shouldn't be pumping this stuff out for ALL auto companies to start using, getting away from anti-freeze. Competition would keep the price low and with so much demand, it could easily be sold for the same price as anti-freeze due to the larger market base. I'm guessing that part of the reason for the higher price is due to the limited consumer base they market to. I mean, I've never seen this stuff advertised at Autozone or Advance Auto, has anyone else? I understand there is a major undertaking to remove the old to use this stuff, but come on. MUCH safer than the existing alternative? I'd go with it. I'm still waiting for the results! Come now Simon, get on with it! :)

[turbovanman²]

I think his point is, it's safer, more effective so why aren't using this as a standard instead of anti-freeze which is extremely toxic and has greater limits than this stuff? Unless the elements in this stuff are rare or harder to come by, there is no reason companies shouldn't be pumping this stuff out for ALL auto companies to start using, getting away from anti-freeze. Competition would keep the price low and with so much demand, it could easily be sold for the same price as anti-freeze due to the larger market base. I'm guessing that part of the reason for the higher price is due to the limited consumer base they market to. I mean, I've never seen this stuff advertised at Autozone or Advance Auto, has anyone else? I understand there is a major undertaking to remove the old to use this stuff, but come on. MUCH safer than the existing alternative? I'd go with it. I'm still waiting for the results! Come now Simon, get on with it! :)

The reason is still cost, 99% of the vehicles out there work just fine with antifreeze, so why would the manufacterer cost himself millions more for a product that is specialized. The other limiting factor is you need to carry spares with you as when you add water/antifreeze, you now have to flush it out and start again.

Its a specialized product for a small, niche market, IE racers and car enthusiasts.

[GLHNSLHT2]

patents might also stop companies from picking it up.

[swiss_daytona]

minigts pretty much got my point. With "bigones" I was rather speaking of the big oil companies than car companies using it oe.
I mean, if this stuff really is superior, there is money to be made with - and that would call in the big ones. How could they pass on a cash cow?
Patents? Maybe, the oil industry got the big bucks though...

[ssheen]

You may not see Evan's in the chain stores but you do see PG anti-freezes. You just may not realise it.

[minigts]

patents might also stop companies from picking it up.

I can appreciate the idea, but I can't imagine a company not jumping on the opportunity of selling more of what they are making. For something like this, I would be more than happy to sell my patent for a cool sum of cash plus some royalties. I'm vain so I can admit my weakness when it comes to millions of dollars. ;)


You may not see Evan's in the chain stores but you do see PG anti-freezes. You just may not realise it.

Yeah, I will be happy to see if anyone sells that stuff down here in the south. I can't say I've ever looked for it on the shelf, but it's hiding if it's sold at any of the stores in this part of the country.

[ssheen]

You see any that are said to be non-toxic or animal friendly, then you are seeing PG anti-freeze. Most on the shelves though are run with water where as Evan's is meant to not be run with water. I have heard of some running the non evan's with out water. No idea how well that worked for them though.

I looked at switching over years ago. I did not because I run an under drive pulley. When I switch over to my electric water pump I plan to though...

[GLHNSLHT2]

what's a UDpulley have to do with it?

[T-Bohn]

i think that the underdrive pulley is better with the evans.....they talked all about it on their website check it out.....I am going ffrom memory so i could be completely backwards

[GLHNSLHT2]

yea since it doesn't boil off as fast or as much I would think it would be just the same or better. Simon any testing yet? I'm really tempted to try some.

[turbovanman²]

yea since it doesn't boil off as fast or as much I would think it would be just the same or better. Simon any testing yet? I'm really tempted to try some.

Not yet, I want to get a baseline with my setup then switch over. I know I'll change it if I go back on the dyno as i can't keep it cool.

[johnl]

Another consideration for OEM manufacturers is the fact that antifreeze is a sacrificial consumable. That is, you got the GM green and the Honda orange or yellow or whatever and each of them includes additives that prevent corrosion of aluminum or iron or brass or copper, depending on what balance of corrosion the engine manufacturer is concerned about. Our old school brass/copper radiators are eaten alive from the inside if you run the wrong coolant.

[turbovanman²]

Another consideration for OEM manufacturers is the fact that antifreeze is a sacrificial consumable. That is, you got the GM green and the Honda orange or yellow or whatever and each of them includes additives that prevent corrosion of aluminum or iron or brass or copper, depending on what balance of corrosion the engine manufacturer is concerned about. Our old school brass/copper radiators are eaten alive from the inside if you run the wrong coolant.

According to Evan's, this stuff won't eat anything and you can leave it in basically forever.




NPG+

Evans NPG+ Waterless Coolant is the recommended coolant for all gasoline and diesel engines. NPG+ is a stand-alone lifetime coolant that does not freeze, or boil over. NPG+ controls detonation, cavitation, and is non-corrosive. Installing NPG+ requires the radiator, engine block and heater core to be drained completely and then filled 100% with NPG+. NPG+ meets or exceeds both the ASTM D 1384 corrosion test and the ASTM D 3306-94 specifications.

Boils 375°F @ 0 psi
Freezes -40°F
Viscosity 2.3cp @ 212°F
Surface Tension 44dyn/cm