intake idea? has it been done?

[turbovanpilot]

everyone seems to agree the runners are too long on the 1 and 2 pc. intakes, the logs runners aren't long. would cutting the top off a log and a 1 pc. and putting the top of the one pc. on the bottom of a log be the best availible? has anyone tried this?

[turbovanman²]

No, not yet, you could be the first.

I don't think the runners are too long or maybe I missed that? :confused:

[LynX853]

its always a debate, people say the runners are too long and to shorten them.

I believe (again this is my opinion based on forced induction research)
that the longer runners help with spool up... and as for choking top end... for a N/A car this is true, but with the air under pressure (boost) its not really effected.

again people will chime in and add their opinions too.

if anything focus on opening up the ports and runners, and making a large plenum. plus the elbow after the TB is pretty restrictive as well

[BadAssPerformance]

long runner helps torque, short helps high rpm HP... who said they were too long? :confused2:

[boost geek]

Here's a wacky idea I had. I had a spare 1 piece intake, and some spare time, so I cut the front section out, and am in the process of cutting off the tops of the runners. I have a 655 head, so I would get the runners welded underneath so I could open up the ports from the oval head. This would cost a fortune on welding, would have to weld right behind the injector bungs, put the top back on, cut and plug the elbow and run a top feed t.b. elbow.
It would have super short but large runners, and a little added plenum volume.
This is a play intake, probably won't be using it.



Maybe I'll just stick with a 2 piece, although I don't wanna open it up for the 655 port till I see how Terry makes out with his...:rockon:

http://i91.photobucket.com/albums/k302/boostgeek/100_2676.jpg

http://i91.photobucket.com/albums/k302/boostgeek/100_2678.jpg

http://i91.photobucket.com/albums/k302/boostgeek/100_2679.jpg

[bakes]

Ok now i see what you were taking about . Now you have to cut the other 3 runner out and add the 3.8 neck onto it

[boost geek]

Probably neck it from the top, not the side. The third pic will be opened to the gasket. Just an idea...

[bakes]

Try and trim the divider down between 1&2 3&4 as far you can go.

[boost geek]

That'll give me something to do this weekend...

Have these too, could cut them off and mount them sideways.
http://i91.photobucket.com/albums/k302/boostgeek/100_2671.jpg

http://i91.photobucket.com/albums/k302/boostgeek/100_2672.jpg

[OmniLuvr]

if your going to run the 655, i would use those minivan intake runners, cut them were there is just a short, 4" or so, straight section and then turn them sideways.

then i would weld a lot of extra aluminum under that 1 piece, along the stabilizer ridge, and a quarter inch past, basicly even with the intake bolt mount. then i would cut the rest of the intake off, where the injector and knock sensor bungs end, this also lines up with the bolt flange face.

now you have an intake manifold flange, it has injector bungs, knock sensor location, its welded for the oval port, and is very easy to port match to your head.

then you weld those oval minivan runners to your new flange, youll have to cut them at almost a 45 degree angle to match flow path, then port match again, this time runners to flange. i think the 4" long runners should be enough to clear a stock fuel rail and damper with the plenum welded on, give you a total runner length of about 6", and hopefully still have enough room to clear turbo, wastegate rod, and be able to sneak the fuel rail out with or without the damper on it?

then weld on the plenum design of your choice to those oval runners. well thats what im about to do.

how bout someone post some pics of a log manifold, i like the idea, i just want to see the location and angle of injector, runner size, and to see how much room there is to port the runner higher or lower? (i want to go higher)

[moparzrule]

The easiest way to shorten runners is to use the 1 piece intake and chop down the runners and make a custom plenum. Thats basically how Aaron does his intakes.
Short runners and large plenum makes for superior upper RPM, turbo or not. I've run a custom short runner huge plenum intake and was making good power up top, I shifted at ~7300 RPM with a stock valve ported head 2.2L with ported exhuast manifold and hybrid turbo. With a ported 2 piece intake I was shifting aroung 6800, but driveability was greatly improved. The short runner large plenum intake KILLED lower end torque.

[BIGBRUDDA]

I like the long runners and torque.I don't like the pinched plenum and 90 deg throttle neck. i'm workin on that.:D

[moparzrule]

Aaron's top half that he builds for the 2 piece intake fixes all that. It's a nice piece.

[BIGBRUDDA]

Don't have a 2 piece. Have several 1 pieces:confused2: Some cut for modification.:eyebrows:Just need a competent welder.:nod:

[chilort]

I have no idea who would cut off the top of a log intake and add a bigger plenum. That's just crazy talk .... oh, wait, that's what I'm doing.

Here's some pictures of my in process porting.
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3187/2982351963_ef46a52705.jpg
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3226/2982355123_00ce9145d2.jpg
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3202/2982346259_70e40590f4.jpg
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3191/2983201178_eae7a543e7.jpg

I've just been a lot too busy to finish this project.

[Keito]

I like the long runners and torque.I don't like the pinched plenum and 90 deg throttle neck. i'm workin on that.:D

I fixed the pinched plenum, but not the 90.http://www.turbo-mopar.com/forums/photopost/showgallery.php?cat=500&ppuser=268

I'm working on a new one with some extra mods.:evil:

[GLHNSLHT2]

Aaron's top half that he builds for the 2 piece intake fixes all that. It's a nice piece.

Aaron's not the only one doing that. http://www.pnw-sdac.org/gallery/main.php?g2_itemId=2533
http://www.turbo-mopar.com/forums/showthread.php?t=31500

[chilort]

Keith, what would you want to finish up my project for me......

Let's just say I like some of your work. :hail:

[moparzrule]

Aaron's not the only one doing that. http://www.pnw-sdac.org/gallery/main.php?g2_itemId=2533
http://www.turbo-mopar.com/forums/showthread.php?t=31500

Well it seems like he's the only one doing it who is atleast a basic vendor anyway.

[moparzrule]

I fixed the pinched plenum, but not the 90.http://www.turbo-mopar.com/forums/photopost/showgallery.php?cat=500&ppuser=268

I'm working on a new one with some extra mods.:evil:

The 90 is a huge improvement over stock. No matter what you do you must have some kind of 90 going into the intake, whether it be actually attached to the intake or the IC piping. Honestly I think what you did is about as good as it gets for the 90.

[GLHNSLHT2]

Well it seems like he's the only one doing it who is atleast a basic vendor anyway.

Well if I see enough interest in it I'll become a vendor too. But being it might be my only product and there might not be enough interest I'm not going to jump right in and fork over the cash.

[moparzrule]

Understandable. Turbo dodge guys always whine about not having new great products, but when people actually produce them no one buys it. So basically it's mostly a ''do it yourself'' kind of thing that most people are doing, and a select few want the same thing and are willing to shell out the cash for it.....a very select few.

[boost geek]

A very select few have the cash to fork out. I'd love a 2 piece upper, but I have to add about 25% just for exchange. Those uppers look great, by the way.:thumb:
How much can a 2 piece lower flow, anyone know?

I got bored again...:p

http://i91.photobucket.com/albums/k302/boostgeek/100_2685.jpg

http://i91.photobucket.com/albums/k302/boostgeek/100_2684.jpg

[bakes]

That sure opens that up.

[GLHNSLHT2]

A very select few have the cash to fork out. I'd love a 2 piece upper, buy I have to add about 25% just for exchange. Those uppers look great, by the way.:thumb:
How much can a 2 piece lower flow, anyone know?

Thanks. I'm a little flexible with canadians. I understand the exchange rate sucks.

[chilort]

I kind of think it is fun to do this stuff. Of course, I like figuring things out for myself in most cases. Even when there are aftermarket parts available, you still have to figure out a package that works together or else you get a bunch of random crap that doesn't play nice.

If I cut an intake up and mess around with it and it doesn't work ... we'll, I did it. If I buy someone else's stuff that doesn't work, I feel like a real fool because I bought their marketing BS.

The home grown stuff gives me a little tickle.

Good work, keep thinking, keep playing, and keep having fun.

[GLHNSLHT2]

you should be able to look at what your buying and figure out if it's gonna work or not. If you don't understand it ask. A good company/person will answer your questions. I've got 7 of these out there at the moment waiting to go onto cars. So we'll soon see how well it works on other platforms other than my own which I LOVE! If you know me and read my posts you know I won't back something if I don't think it works.

[Aries_Turbo]

http://www.turbo-mopar.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=12835&stc=1&d=1235240005

youll want to chop out the area with a red x and weld a plate in to match the curvature of the back wall so you dont have a large chunk of metal blocking airflow to the #1 and #2 runners seeing as you have to have it all welded up anyway.

Brian

[boost geek]

Like this?:eyebrows:
You can see where I cut through the runner on the #2 cyl. If you add a bunch of weld there, the runner can opened up very large to match the 655 port, along with welding under the runner boss.

Sorry if I hijacked this thread.:o

http://i91.photobucket.com/albums/k302/boostgeek/100_2686.jpg

http://i91.photobucket.com/albums/k302/boostgeek/100_2689.jpg

http://i91.photobucket.com/albums/k302/boostgeek/100_2687.jpg

[Aries_Turbo]

yeah like that :)

Brian

[bakes]

Looking good Dick!
Now cut the neck off and splice in the 3.3/3.8l neck and a Jeep 4.0l HO throttle body.

[Aries_Turbo]

back to the original topic for a sec.... the log manifold has a problem that might cause you trouble especially when turning up the wick... the injectors are right above the hot exhaust manifold and turbo. the factory had that shield on them but you might need some additional shielding and stuff.

Brian

[OmniLuvr]

hey, will someone make a "show off your custom intakes and progress" thread, i havent made quite enough progress on mine yet, but pics will be coming soon.

[moparzrule]

back to the original topic for a sec.... the log manifold has a problem that might cause you trouble especially when turning up the wick... the injectors are right above the hot exhaust manifold and turbo. the factory had that shield on them but you might need some additional shielding and stuff.

Brian

I agree, but also the angle of the injector shooting into the intake tract just isn't as good as where it is in the 1 piece intake. IMO starting with the 1 piece intake (or 2 piece lower) is better than any modified log.

[BadAssPerformance]

OK, maybe I missed it, but what is the goal of this? Super short runners?

http://i91.photobucket.com/albums/k302/boostgeek/100_2686.jpg

BTW... doeant everyone run 11's on a ported stocker? ;)

[The Pope]

its always a debate, people say the runners are too long and to shorten them.

I believe (again this is my opinion based on forced induction research)
that the longer runners help with spool up... and as for choking top end... for a N/A car this is true, but with the air under pressure (boost) its not really effected.

again people will chime in and add their opinions too.

if anything focus on opening up the ports and runners, and making a large plenum. plus the elbow after the TB is pretty restrictive as well

When you have a NA engine and it is unrestricted with a good air cleaner and exhaust the system is much different. You need to have a longer intake runner to slightly restrict the air flow enough so it won't destablize. If you have too much intake and floor it and the vac drops to zero in the runners the engine stumbles. If the exhaust tube header size is too large or too short or both you get the same problem. So you get that ballenced size so the runners and the exhaust tubes are both sized right to ballence the air flow at both ends. Then you make more power. :clap:

This is a big waste of time with a turbo engine. Your exhaust is restricted and back pressured by the turbine and the intake has to suck through the compressor, intercooler and all the long intake tract. On the exhaust velocity is nice to cause some spool. But the wives tales on the intakes is a joke. With all the intake track resistance out of boost the runner vac doesn't drop and destablize. I enlarged the runners and polished them like chrome on GLHNSLHT2s lower piece, which shortened the runners too. Then the intake uses a plenum 3 times larger and a true 58mm TB. Floor it at 700 RPM in 4th gear and the engine pulls hard and stready till it spools the turbo at 1,500 RPM. No stumble or loss of torque of anykind, it gained torque.. Unless your getting really crazy with 2" runners, 4L plenum and 70mm TB with 3" IC lines your not going to loose any torque. Your just going to make more HP per PSI. Of course the whole rest of the Compact world knows this while some TD people scratch there heads:ballchain:

I see people that tap out there 8v engines with a stock intake. Then they think O it is all the head and go 16v. Then instead of running a stock Stratus intake like our 8v intakes, the first thing people do is hack the thing as short as they can and add a big plenum. Why isn't everyone doing the same things to an 8v? Because some one said it kills torque in back in the dark ages? Kidding? :confused:

[GLHNSLHT2]

Unless your getting really crazy with 2" runners,

careful, the ports in the intake start out at 1.92" after the plenum. So you're only .080" smaller than your comment :)

[The Pope]

careful, the ports in the intake start out at 1.92" after the plenum. So you're only .080" smaller than your comment :)

DOH! 3" then :p

[boost geek]

OK, maybe I missed it, but what is the goal of this? Super short runners?

http://i91.photobucket.com/albums/k302/boostgeek/100_2686.jpg

BTW... doeant everyone run 11's on a ported stocker? ;)

My goal was to make an intake just for the 655 oval port head. I have an unmolested 2 piece, but I didn't want to open it up for the oval port, because then I can't use it for a regular port head.
I opened this intake to see what it looks like, glad I cut it open the way I did. The way it looks now is not done yet. The Pope had a good idea to get another 1 piece, and cut the Y runners out of it, and flip them upside down. The runners will then be covered. I'll have to stop by the j.y. after work and grab another intake, and shove it through the band saw.

[BadAssPerformance]

OK, that was my question, was hopin those were gonna be cappe doff. Just buy some 1/4" aluminum sheet and weld a top on the runners?

[boost geek]

That would be easier, but should be pretty thick to leave room for reshaping the roof.

[The Pope]

My goal was to make an intake just for the 655 oval port head. I have an unmolested 2 piece, but I didn't want to open it up for the oval port, because then I can't use it for a regular port head.

After you build a 655 do you plan to step backwards to the little ports? :confused:

I don't think it is a bad idea because I don't see myself taking the 655 off for any reason later...:nod:

[bakes]

Dick have you cut the neck of yet and add the 3.3 neck for mock up ?

[boost geek]

No, havent added the neck yet. Looking into getting a bottle of argon at work.
I wanted to leave the 2 piece alone, could always use it in the future for a trade for something.:nod:
I have this rail coming also, has the center tube removed.

http://i91.photobucket.com/albums/k302/boostgeek/100_0342.jpg