LM and MAP question time.

[85_600]

(Still a newb to this stuff but I'm getting better) :D

I've got a 87 Shelby Z LM. Comparing it to the earlier style LM, there is no MAP on the outside. That's ok, I know it's on the inside. BUT, doesn't the MAP need a vaccum source? If so, where does it get it? There is no vaccum line on the outside of this LM I have.

Thanks!
Paul

[cordes]

The map is not in the LM it requires and external map which is normally mounted under the hood on the fire wall or strut tower. You will have to run 3 wires to the map under the hood and then connect it to manifold vac.

You can look at just about any turbo dodge in the yard these days and see how they are set up.

[85_600]

The map is not in the LM it requires and external map which is normally mounted under the hood on the fire wall or strut tower. You will have to run 3 wires to the map under the hood and then connect it to manifold vac.

You can look at just about any turbo dodge in the yard these days and see how they are set up.


Ding!! A light goes off in my head. :o

That explains why some LM have the vaccum line coming off the side of the box, and some don't. The ones without it need what you said above - mount a separate MAP under the hood.

Ok, so, can I use the old plug or do I need to get one of these as well as a AIS plug? And, is there any modifications needed to get a new one working with the newer-ish LM.

[GLHSKEN]

There are also pin-0out differences. You should stick with what the car had until you are fully ready to convert. The pin-out is not that bad (I'
m an accountant and I did it) but just get it running then fool with things. Too many changes at once leads to problems.

[85_600]

There are also pin-0out differences. You should stick with what the car had until you are fully ready to convert. The pin-out is not that bad (I'
m an accountant and I did it) but just get it running then fool with things. Too many changes at once leads to problems.

Would I be better off swapping the LM I have with say, an 86 version that has a MAP on the LM? I wouldn't mind the swap if it would mean less problems down the road.

[85_600]

Would I be better off swapping the LM I have with say, an 86 version that has a MAP on the LM? I wouldn't mind the swap if it would mean less problems down the road.

Just a bump here. I'd like some input on this swap I considered.

Also, IF the 87 LM is the way to go, how would I go about hooking up a new MAP - new plug or an old plug scavenged off of another TD?

Thanks!
P

[GLHSKEN]

I would go with the 86 module and swap to the 86 distributer (required as well).

If you do Go 87 module, you will need to get the underhood set-up from a car. 2 ways to mount it. No matter what, you will need to add the wires to the connector and move a coulle more.

Here is the basic info from a thread on TD.com.

Move Pin #4 on the Blue Connector (Black/orange or pink)
to Pin #4 on the Red Connector (Just cut the old orange/green wire it's useless on the T2 Swap part)

Move Pin #14 on the blue connector (white/orange)
to Pin #14 on the Red Connector

Map Wiring
Use the White/Violet one off the "underhood map" or the Red Wire on the stock map too The Red connector Pin #1

Use the Dark Green/Red off the "underhood map" or the Black wire on the stock map too The blue connector Pin #19

Use THe Black/Light blue wire off the "underhood map" or the white wire on the stock map and splice it into The Red Connector
Pin #25

For the TPS, just match the wires on the old connector too the new connector

For the AIS, match up the old wires too there matching ones, and for the two extra ones

Black/Yellow To Pin #16 on the Red Connector
Violet/Brown to Pin #20 on the Red Connector

This is a picture of the "Pinouts"
http://www.minimopar.net/ecu/lm-1986-t1.html
http://www.minimopar.net/ecu/lm-1987-t2.html

Just incase you get confused check those pages this is all the help I had too figure it out, you should do just fine, took me like 10 minutes after getting the wires through the firewall... which too me about an

[5sp. mini]

i have the out side wireing you need on a 89 t1 hardess i might have a map too.right or print the stuff ken posted it nice to have in the car when you are doing the wire swap AL

[85_600]

I would go with the 86 module and swap to the 86 distributer (required as well).

That would be this type, correct?
http://www.wadsnet.com/~megadeus/Pics/86lm.jpg

That is, with the MAP on the outside....

Any difference in the plugs for the MAP from 85 to 86? Or would I need to swipe one from an 86?

BTW: This info is the BEST!!:thumb:

P

[GLHSKEN]

Map is the same

[85_600]

Map is the same


:thumb:

[boost geek]

Do just the 87 Shelby Chargers (and all L bodies) have the on-board map sensors?

[GLHSKEN]

Any 86 and down car has the on board. plus the 87 SC's. 87 SC and GLHS still use the 86 electronics. In 87 all cars went to the 87 modules where the map is underhood.

[85_600]

I would go with the 86 module and swap to the 86 distributer (required as well).

If you do Go 87 module, you will need to get the underhood set-up from a car. 2 ways to mount it. No matter what, you will need to add the wires to the connector and move a coulle more.

Here is the basic info from a thread on TD.com.

Move Pin #4 on the Blue Connector (Black/orange or pink)
to Pin #4 on the Red Connector (Just cut the old orange/green wire it's useless on the T2 Swap part)

Move Pin #14 on the blue connector (white/orange)
to Pin #14 on the Red Connector

Map Wiring
Use the White/Violet one off the "underhood map" or the Red Wire on the stock map too The Red connector Pin #1

Use the Dark Green/Red off the "underhood map" or the Black wire on the stock map too The blue connector Pin #19

Use THe Black/Light blue wire off the "underhood map" or the white wire on the stock map and splice it into The Red Connector
Pin #25

For the TPS, just match the wires on the old connector too the new connector

For the AIS, match up the old wires too there matching ones, and for the two extra ones

Black/Yellow To Pin #16 on the Red Connector
Violet/Brown to Pin #20 on the Red Connector

This is a picture of the "Pinouts"
http://www.minimopar.net/ecu/lm-1986-t1.html
http://www.minimopar.net/ecu/lm-1987-t2.html

Just incase you get confused check those pages this is all the help I had too figure it out, you should do just fine, took me like 10 minutes after getting the wires through the firewall... which too me about an


Just "re-hashing" this pin swap on the 87 LM, if I decide to use it:

For all of these pin swaps listed above, is that it? Just swapping these, not using a harness, this will get me up and running? Remember: I'm not an electrical type of guy, even though I work on computers alot, it's just hardware, not the electrical portion.

I do have a spare LM now so I can see what's up with the pin outs and wire colors. I just don't want to f something up...

Thanks!
P

**EDIT**
I found this at TheDodgeGarage:


In 1987 Chrysler changed around the pinouts of the logic module in the majority of cars to accommodate external map sensors and ECU controlled cruise control.

If the above in RED is the only change then this should not be a problem - BUT, I'd like clarification on the changes if possible.

[85_600]

Ahh, forget my last post here. I found a post from Ken on TD...:o It answered my question.

[85_600]

Sort of an update - More or less another question.

After all the pin swapping is done, the rest of the Blue and Red connector wires - do they get spliced into the existing wires?

I think this one deserves a BIG :o

Thanks,
Paul

[cordes]

I am not really sure what you are asking, but once the wires are swapped from one connector to the other that is it. The added wires for the AIS, TPS and map just get plugged in.

[85_600]

Sorry, yeah, that was kind of vague on my part...

Here, when the pin swapping is done, there should only be the ones that were swapped coming out of the Red and Blue connectors?

Like this:
http://www.wadsnet.com/~megadeus/Pics/Pin%20Swap.JPG

The old connectors have a mess of cut wires coming from them. Once the swap is done, there should only be the ones that are mentioned, The AIS, TPS, MAP and O2? I hope that helps. :o

[85_600]

BRAIN FART TIME.....

Yes, I can be a real dummy sometimes...

Basically I got confused about the LM I have that will be used as the pin supply. I was thinking that I had to splice together all the wires on the spare into the existing wiring harness...No No, I'm just using "PINS" with a little bit of wire on them, from the spare LM. The existing pins will be pulled out and the new ones put in, then that wire will be spliced in...

Go on, carry on with your day people. Don't bother with the "New Guy"...:o :o :D

[85_600]

Ok, I'm normal now...:D

Question time: How do I pull a spare pin out of the plug? I have the lock out but the little bit of wire attached to the pin just doesn't want to pop out.

Thanks!
Paul

[cordes]

The metal piece that locks into the connector is crimped onto the wire, so I would just splice another wire on to the end of it if you are taking it out for the metal piece that goes into the connector on the LM.

[85_600]

I got the one side, the one that has the little catch "thingy" on it. I'll have to work on the other side of the pins to figure out how to get them out (the ones that don't have the catch "thingy" on them) :D

Thanks!
P

[85_600]

Something else I noticed. "Some" of the wire colors don't match what's listed over at Mini Mopar for the pin out guide. Is this standard procedure or do I have a different year LM. The date on the spare is 12/09/1986.

Thanks!
P

**EDIT** I just checked some of the odd ball colored wires from my spare LM against the pin out guide at Mini Mopar. The 12/09/86 LM I have as a spare is a 87 LM. I had two wires that didn't match the color scheme for an 86 T1. I pulled up the scheme for the 87 T2 LM and the two wires in question were the same.

[85_600]

Alright - another round of MAP questions here:

I was just in the For Sale section and noticed a MAP/Baro sensor for sale from a 87 Daytona. Now, on my T2 conversion, I have "only" the MAP from the Daytona. In addition, in my shopping around at Advanced Auto/AZ/Rockauto, no one sells "just" the Baro sensor.

Is the Baro sensor from my 85 600 good enough to use or do I need the one from the 87? I can't find one for an 87 anywhere but for the 85, the only item available is the MAP/Baro "combo"

Any help in this would be GREAT!!

Thanks,
Paul

[cordes]

I just ran a line from the baro read solenoid to my 3 bar map. No problems at all.

http://omniglht.com/cals/3barfront.JPG

[85_600]

I think what is confusing me here is: Are there "two" separate items here: #1 being the MAP and #2 being the Baro sensor? Or are they all combined into one unit?

From your pic Cordes that looks like they are all in one. (I really hate not having the car close at hand :mad: - I can't just run out and look at my parts)..

I should be making a trip North (to the car that is :D ) in the next few days. I've got to take an inventory of everything and separate it all out so I'm not diggin around at the last minute.

Thanks!
Paul

**EDIT** Oh wait a minute - Is that vaccum line coming from the right side of the MAP the Baro sensor? Is it a part of that vaccum block (or what I thought was a vaccum block?)

[GLHSKEN]

The 88 cars were a single unit plumbed together. The pic is of an earlier quad solenoid unit as seen in 86 and earlier cars with a cable tie holding the map to the set-up/ .

[85_600]

The 88 cars were a single unit plumbed together. The pic is of an earlier quad solenoid unit as seen in 86 and earlier cars with a cable tie holding the map to the set-up/ .

Ah haaa...Ok. I thought that was a vaccum block. :o

On my 85, the best way to determine which one is the baro, is to follow the vaccum line and see where it goes? Like, if it goes to the MAP, then that's the Baro sensor?

And, can the 85 Baro work well with the 87 MAP I have?

[GLHSKEN]

You can set yours up exaclty liker the pic. Furthest in = map, 2nd =boost, 3rd =egr, 4th =charcoal canister.

[cordes]

The 88 cars were a single unit plumbed together. The pic is of an earlier quad solenoid unit as seen in 86 and earlier cars with a cable tie holding the map to the set-up/ .

The zip ties look better in person I swear.:nod:

[85_600]

The zip ties look better in person I swear.:nod:

I'll probably use black to blend in with the rest of the color of the 600:thumb:

That's a nice way to install it btw. I was wondering how and where to put the MAP. I hope I have enough wire for it. Mine (the sensor block thingy) is about a foot away from the coil, not on the strut tower.

[GLHSKEN]

lol :thumb:

[cordes]

I'll probably use black to blend in with the rest of the color of the 600:thumb:

That's a nice way to install it btw. I was wondering how and where to put the MAP. I hope I have enough wire for it. Mine (the sensor block thingy) is about a foot away from the coil, not on the strut tower.

Yeah, I had every thing out to make a bracket to mount it to the strut tower, but I thought that with all the zip ties that will be on all the hoses when the boost gets cranked up, I might as well complete the look. I actually think that it looks a little cleaner of an install right there too.