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View Full Version : Jeep Liberty Turbo Diesel???...what?!...just curious any potential?



turbo600
10-18-2008, 03:36 PM
during my search for a Cummins pickup, I stumbled upon a bunch of Jeep liberty Turbo Diesels, I never knew about them til now...now Im just curious about them, is there any performance potential with these little SUVs or is it just a new problem prone motor?...Im still buying a Cummins Ram, but a little Liberty could make a sweet daily driver on the side one day ya know..its got if I remember correctly 160 HP and 295 TQ...thats awesome!

GLHNSLHT2
10-18-2008, 04:47 PM
problem prone setup. The tranny has issues and I've known one that had to replace the turbo with very low miles. On the otherhand my g/f's 3.7 Gas 04 libby just rolled 70k miles and have had it into the dealer only twice. Once for a TSB and the other to have the tranny flushed. Other than that it's been tires, gas and oil changes. Best time has been a 16.5 at the track (can't remember the MPH). That was shallow staging it. With me, my g/f and my 2 kids in the back it ran consistent 17.0's deep staging putting lots of much faster cars and a high 9 second Busa on the trailer till we came home with a trophy :)

Keito
10-18-2008, 04:52 PM
I looked at these extensivly a few years ago.
Torque converters were junk.
There's a forum for them, thats how I found out.

JDAWG
10-18-2008, 08:15 PM
the TSB they perform on it actually reduces the power as they were having trans problems, it detunes it and there is no way to change the software back to the way it was before. Had many customers complain about it after it was done about losing power. I have no clue if anyone is hopping these up. They had problems with oil being in the air filter and intercooler and alot of turbos got replaced, the pcv system was the problem though. I have a turbo sitting here and nothing wrong with it, got replaced before anyone figured out that it wasnt the problem. Its a VNT turbo.

fleckster
10-19-2008, 05:30 PM
There is NOTHING wrong with the strength of the Liberty diesel transmissions (other than their unique torque converters) as it is the same transmission as the Hemi Rams (545RFE) which makes more torque than this diesel. The problem was in getting the converter right. They still use this in export diesel Wrangers. They are now using a different coonverter that didn't make it before they quit being able to sell diesel Liberties. You might be able to order one of them. I could get the part number...

JDAWG
10-19-2008, 06:00 PM
would someone want to buy a liberty diesel then put a new tc in it? Chrysler issued a recall to detune the engine cause the tc was junk, tc shudder.

WVRampage
10-19-2008, 07:09 PM
I have a low mile turbo there that has a oil leak,parts can be had to rebuild them for about 80 bucks.

fleckster
10-19-2008, 07:24 PM
would someone want to buy a liberty diesel then put a new tc in it? Chrysler issued a recall to detune the engine cause the tc was junk, tc shudder.

I wasn't suggesting that someone do that. I was just stating it say if there was an instance where someone could get one cheap because the converter was bad in it or if someone themselves had one that was acting up and didn't want to have their engine performance turned down. That and defending the transmission we build at our Plant. (The torque converters are made elsewhere and it is actually a design problem from CTC.)

Vigo
10-21-2008, 09:21 PM
honestly im very surprised you got a 16.5 out of a liberty 3.7. I've HATED the 3.7 ever since it first came out and i've never driven a 3.7 anything that felt like it could run 16s.

fleckster
10-21-2008, 09:33 PM
The 3.7L V6's days are numbered. It will be phased out shortly with the new Phoenix V6 engines. (State of the Art modern V6 family to replace all the current V6 engines including the 3.3/3.8L, 2.7/3.5/4.0L in addition to the 3.7L) It will feature DOHC, VVT, Direct Injection, and even MDS.

GLHNSLHT2
10-21-2008, 09:51 PM
honestly im very surprised you got a 16.5 out of a liberty 3.7. I've HATED the 3.7 ever since it first came out and i've never driven a 3.7 anything that felt like it could run 16s.

Motor Trend got a 16.7 out of it :) The trick is to run Mobil 1 5w30 and deep stage. It's faster than a Caliber R/T :)

GLHNSLHT2
10-21-2008, 09:54 PM
The 3.7L V6's days are numbered. It will be phased out shortly with the new Phoenix V6 engines. (State of the Art modern V6 family to replace all the current V6 engines including the 3.3/3.8L, 2.7/3.5/4.0L in addition to the 3.7L) It will feature DOHC, VVT, Direct Injection, and even MDS.

When is that due out Fleck? Also any news about the Getrag tranny situation. My G/f wants an Avenger R/T AWD and it'd be sweet to have a new engine and a paddle shifted tranny.

black86glhs
10-21-2008, 09:57 PM
Motor Trend got a 16.7 out of it :) The trick is to run Mobil 1 5w30 and deep stage. It's faster than a Caliber R/T :)
So the 3.7 Liberty is faster than the turbo Caliber R/T? Did I miss something?

Vigo
10-21-2008, 10:11 PM
no, you didnt. all cvt calibers are slow, period. most manual ones too, with a notable exception for the turbo one...

the 3.7 was a damn stupid idea in the first place. as far as i can tell, it effectively took a proven 3.9 engine, decided to make it less useful, and spent a bunch of money adding complexity and losing torque. It must have been a handout to the uaw plant that built the 4.7.. Sure, its got better power past 4k rpm, but by the time you ever get to 4k rpm you already lost cuz the low end blows. They should have just put the 60 degree 3.8 in liberty from the beginning and never even built the 3.7. now its being replaced by an OLDER engine design.. the 3.5 derivative 4.0.

black86glhs
10-21-2008, 10:30 PM
no, you didnt. all cvt calibers are slow, period. most manual ones too, with a notable exception for the turbo one...

the 3.7 was a damn stupid idea in the first place. as far as i can tell, it effectively took a proven 3.9 engine, decided to make it less useful, and spent a bunch of money adding complexity and losing torque. It must have been a handout to the uaw plant that built the 4.7.. Sure, its got better power past 4k rpm, but by the time you ever get to 4k rpm you already lost cuz the low end blows. They should have just put the 60 degree 3.8 in liberty from the beginning and never even built the 3.7. now its being replaced by an OLDER engine design.. the 3.5 derivative 4.0.
I thought the R/Ts were the turbo models, that is why I asked. I know the rest of them are slugs.
I wondered the same thing about the 3.8 versus the 3.7. Granted the 4.0 inline was the jeep engine, not the 3.9. The 4.0 was too harsh to stay, but the 3.9 was a good engine.

fleckster
10-21-2008, 10:48 PM
When is that due out Fleck? Also any news about the Getrag tranny situation. My G/f wants an Avenger R/T AWD and it'd be sweet to have a new engine and a paddle shifted tranny.

I guess you haven't heard. Chrysler and Getrag are splitsville. Chrysler is sueing Getrag over the breach of contact (i.e. not securing funding for the new Plant in Tipton, IN.) The joint venture is dead. What does that mean as far as Chrysler buying and using a Dual Wet Clutch Transmission? It is still unknown but at least they won't be making them together. It more than likely wouldn't have been a paddle shift anyway. They probably would have just used the current method Autostick style shifters since it is all electronic anyway when in manual mode.



the 3.7 was a damn stupid idea in the first place. as far as i can tell, it effectively took a proven 3.9 engine, decided to make it less useful, and spent a bunch of money adding complexity and losing torque. It must have been a handout to the uaw plant that built the 4.7.. Sure, its got better power past 4k rpm, but by the time you ever get to 4k rpm you already lost cuz the low end blows. They should have just put the 60 degree 3.8 in liberty from the beginning and never even built the 3.7. now its being replaced by an OLDER engine design.. the 3.5 derivative 4.0.

The 3.7L is the only engine available in the Liberty. The 4.0L is reserved for use in the Nitro. Why? Can't answer that one.


I thought the R/Ts were the turbo models, that is why I asked. I know the rest of them are slugs.
I wondered the same thing about the 3.8 versus the 3.7. Granted the 4.0 inline was the jeep engine, not the 3.9. The 4.0 was too harsh to stay, but the 3.9 was a good engine.

The only Caliber turbo model is the SRT-4. Caliber R/Ts are NA 2.4L making 172hp.

black86glhs
10-21-2008, 11:15 PM
The only Caliber turbo model is the SRT-4. Caliber R/Ts are NA 2.4L making 172hp.
Gotcha. :thumb:

GLHNSLHT2
10-21-2008, 11:24 PM
when are the new pheonix engines due out? The current 3.5 R/T Avenger AWD is quick but the MPG isn't any better than her Libby.

I had heard about the lawsuit, didn't know if they were still continuing with the project though or not.

fleckster
10-22-2008, 02:41 AM
I don't know for sure but I think the 2010 Model Year.

JDAWG
10-22-2008, 01:13 PM
They do have a ton of engines now that aernt really needed.

135sohc
10-22-2008, 01:43 PM
when are the new pheonix engines due out? The current 3.5 R/T Avenger AWD is quick but the MPG isn't any better than her Libby.

I had heard about the lawsuit, didn't know if they were still continuing with the project though or not.



its been rumored that the entire pheonix engine program got cut also. :(

fleckster
10-22-2008, 02:17 PM
I don't think so. They spent a bunch of money to upgrade a couple engine plants and that work is now done. Last I heard they were running off equipment.

135sohc
10-22-2008, 03:34 PM
It all rumor at this point and nobody is talking but considering how chrysler/cerberus has apparently pulled the plug on the AMT's out of nowhere.

killing this wouldnt be a huge suprise

http://www.motorauthority.com/chrysler-kills-phoenix-v6-project-ahead-of-merger.html

Vigo
10-22-2008, 09:22 PM
i was referring to the 4.0 v6. not the old 4.0 jeep motor, which i actually really liked but which unfortunately went mostly ignored for over a decade when there was massive room for improvement..

the 3.9 i like durability wise, but power wise i feel like its way down on a good running 4.0 jeep or a 4.3 chevy even. compared to the modern small truck v6s its down like 70 hp too :p

chrysler needs BOTH the phoenix and the new trannies or it WILL die. decades of inferiority in the bread and butter market segments will doom the company unless those two things can turn it around.

but of course, it's just too damn late to do the things that should have been done in the 90s, like drop every stupid v6 other than the 3.3/3.5/3.8 and focus development on those, even making smaller displacement versions for the smaller cars. the 3.3/3.8 ohv are way more compact than either the 2.5 mitsu or 2.7 chrysler and could easily have been made to have adequate power and noise characteristics even at a smaller displacement if they'd just put a little effort into it.

the 3.7, 2.7, and 2.5 mitsu were all mistakes to me. NOT using the 3.3/3.8 design in more body styles was stupid. Leaving the 3.5 alone for so many years and letting everyone else pass them up was damn stupid, as was waiting this long to bring out a larger displacement version. the 6 speed 604 (61te) would have been real nice 4 years ago too.

black86glhs
10-22-2008, 10:47 PM
I knew you were referring to the 60* 4.0. I said, in a poor way, that the 4.0 inline was only in the Jeeps and the 3.9 was only in the Dodges. For some reason, they wouldn't use one in the other for many years?????
Anyway, the last 3.9s were putting out 175 hp and 225 lb ft. Heck the 4.3 is only putting out 195 or 200 depending on what you read and I like the 4.3. They could have revised it and added a balance shaft to get smoother power. The 3.8 did make the same HP but better torque. Finally, it made it into the wrangler. I agree it should have been in the Liberty.

fleckster
10-23-2008, 07:07 PM
its been rumored that the entire pheonix engine program got cut also. :(


Here's a new story from today!:



10/23/2008
by Kevin Krolicki
Chrysler says still moving ahead with new engine


DETROIT (Reuters) - Chrysler LLC is moving ahead with investment in a more fuel-efficient V-6 engine program, a senior executive said on Wednesday, declining to comment on the automaker's merger talks with General Motors Corp. (GM.N: Quote, Profile, Research, Stock Buzz)

"The Phoenix engine program is going forward full steam," Chrysler President Jim Press told reporters. "It's a great engine. We're driving the prototypes today."

Chrysler announced plans to invest roughly $3 billion in the new engine program in 2007, just on the cusp of its acquisition by Cerberus Capital Management.

With Cerberus shopping Chrysler to potential buyers, including GM, according to people familiar with those negotiations, speculation has grown that the engine could be put on hold.

Press added: "There's not a lot of reason to talk about mergers and things like that because it's all speculation."

When asked directly whether Cerberus was meeting with potential bidders for Chrysler, Press declined to comment.

"I can't really talk about that," he said.

(c) 2007 Reuters Limited
© 2007 Dow Jones Reuters Business Interactive LLC (trading as Factiva). All rights reserved.

Vigo
10-23-2008, 07:17 PM
good news! they need that engine family like crazy. not because it will be INSANELY superior to what they could have done with the sohc 3.5 and 4.0 by now.. but because they'll finally ditch all the excess engines and focus development money on one!

of course.. nissan's 13 year head start on that is hard to beat. i still hold hope, though. to swap a vq into a dodge, that is. :p

GLHNSLHT2
10-23-2008, 07:56 PM
pffft Nissaaaan. Mopar has the skills to blow them out of the water Tech wise. They just need to do it.