Acclaim Brake Upgrade

[contraption22]

Can I upgrade the front brakes on the front of my '93 TBI Acclaim without having to upgrade the master cylinder? I'd like some larger rotors so I don't warp them like I have been in city driving, but I would rather not start replacing the master cylinder and hard lines, which would undoubtably break.

Thanks,

Mike.

[Tony Hanna]

http://www.knizefamily.net/minimopar/perf/brakes.html

According to Russ' site, if you upgrade to the 60mm (minivan) calipers, you need the 24mm master cylinder "to balance the additional fluid movement requirements of the 60mm calipers".
I'm not sure what the result would be if you used the smaller MC. Maybe more travel before you get a firm pedal?

[Vigo]

it would never really be firm.. but it would stop fine. I've done it. Bigger MC seems to be more for feel than actual function, but the proportioning valve thing when going from drum to disc in the back is serious business...:p

as for bigger rotors im pretty sure you've got the 10.25 already and putting a bigger caliper on it isnt gonna keep the rotors from warping so your only option is the 11" brakes. I see plenty of newer daytonas with them, seems like MANY of the 91-93 tonas got the big brakes regardless of turbo motor or trim. Its a very easy swap and if you already have the 60mm front pistons (my 93 dynasty did) the 11.25 front brakes caliper piston is the same and wouldnt constitute any difference to your MC.

[turbovanman²]

Just get 11 inch rotors, then find a GTC, R/T or Grand Mini, 91 and up, grab the calipers and adapters, bolt to your car, done. If you want to get more rear braking to help the front work less, grab the rear disc setup off the cars, bolt on affair, :nod:

[Tony Hanna]

So the '91 and up Grand Minis used 11" rotors? Was the bolt pattern the same or would you need to get a set of rotors for a car with 11" brakes and just use the calipers/adapters from the van?

I'd like to do this to the Spirit eventually and get the braking close to stock R/T performance. If possible I'd like to get as much as I can new from the parts store. I'm guessing I'd have to get the adapters out of a junkyard though right?

Thanks,
Tony

[turbovanman²]

So the '91 and up Grand Minis used 11" rotors? Was the bolt pattern the same or would you need to get a set of rotors for a car with 11" brakes and just use the calipers/adapters from the van?

I'd like to do this to the Spirit eventually and get the braking close to stock R/T performance. If possible I'd like to get as much as I can new from the parts store. I'm guessing I'd have to get the adapters out of a junkyard though right?

Thanks,
Tony

Yep, 91 and up was a good year for us, as all regular cars/vans used the same setup, albeit the vans knuckle has a different mounting point for the tie rod to limit travel but they all used the same calipers and brakes, 10 and 11 inch so interchanging is cake, just get the matching calipers/brackets and go to town.
Vans, you can't use the rotors unless you redrill as they are the large bolt pattern.

[Tony Hanna]

Ok, I've got it sorted out in my head now. Thanks Simon!

[contraption22]

http://www.knizefamily.net/minimopar/perf/brakes.html

According to Russ' site, if you upgrade to the 60mm (minivan) calipers, you need the 24mm master cylinder "to balance the additional fluid movement requirements of the 60mm calipers".
I'm not sure what the result would be if you used the smaller MC. Maybe more travel before you get a firm pedal?

Russ's site has me a little confused. When talking about the front calipers, he mentions nothing of the 11" brakes from the front of Daytonas, Lebarons and Spirits.

[Tony Hanna]

Russ's site has me a little confused. When talking about the front calipers, he mentions nothing of the 11" brakes from the front of Daytonas, Lebarons and Spirits.

Yeah, it seems like the SLH packages are designed around stuff that would be really easy to find in a junkyard which sort of rules out the 11" stuff unless you go the route Simon and I were discussing with the calipers/adapters from a '91+ van and a new set of R/T rotors from the parts store. Or get lucky enough to find a car with 11" brakes in a junkyard...

[contraption22]

Yeah, it seems like the SLH packages are designed around stuff that would be really easy to find in a junkyard which sort of rules out the 11" stuff unless you go the route Simon and I were discussing with the calipers/adapters from a '91+ van and a new set of R/T rotors from the parts store. Or get lucky enough to find a car with 11" brakes in a junkyard...

So are 89-91 Shelby Daytona brakes the same as the Minivan brakes?

[bgbmxer]

11 inch brakes are not that hard to find

[contraption22]

11 inch brakes are not that hard to find

Yes it looks like I should be able to find any later model FWD mopar with 15" wheels to get them.

[cordes]

So are 89-91 Shelby Daytona brakes the same as the Minivan brakes?

No, the later minivan brakes use a caliper bracket as opposed to the earlier cars which had that provision on the knuckle itself. I don't know if you can take the latter caliper and bolt it to the earlier knuckle.

[Vigo]

imo 91-up knuckles are the ---- for swapping because you can swap caliper brackets on them and not have to change the spindle to upgrade to 11" discs.

as mentioned, if you have a 91-up car or front spindles, any old grand caravan 91-95 will have the correct calipers and caliper brackets on it which will bolt right onto your car.

those vans use a bigger pattern 5x114.3 but the rotor is the same diameter as the r/t style brakes.

so instead of having to find a whole 11" brake setup on a relatively uncommon car, you get the calipers/brackets from ubiquitous grand caravans and get the new, unwarped rotors from your local parts store. ordering rotors for a number of cars will get you the right ones but a 92 spirit r/t or daytona iroc r/t is a sure bet.

[turbovanman²]

So are 89-91 Shelby Daytona brakes the same as the Minivan brakes?

No, 91 and up.

See post 6, ;)

[contraption22]

No, 91 and up.

See post 6, ;)

So all i need to do for my '93 TBI car is use my existing calipers, get caliper brackets for a 91-up Grand Caravan, rotors for a Spirit R/T, and I am ok?

[turbovanman²]

So all i need to do for my '93 TBI car is use my existing calipers, get caliper brackets for a 91-up Grand Caravan, rotors for a Spirit R/T, and I am ok?

Get new calipers and brackets OFF a van or car with 11 inch brakes, buy new rotors, done.

[Tony Hanna]

Ok, now I'm confused again. If I'm going to go with the 11" mini brakes on an '89, do I need the knuckles off of the van, or will the brackets from the mini allow me to bolt the calipers to the '89 knuckles?

Thanks,
Tony

[cordes]

Ok, now I'm confused again. If I'm going to go with the 11" mini brakes on an '89, do I need the knuckles off of the van, or will the brackets from the mini allow me to bolt the calipers to the '89 knuckles?

Thanks,
Tony

I believe you need the knuckles off of a cast control arm car.

[turbovanman²]

Ok, now I'm confused again. If I'm going to go with the 11" mini brakes on an '89, do I need the knuckles off of the van, or will the brackets from the mini allow me to bolt the calipers to the '89 knuckles?

Thanks,
Tony

No, the above applies for 91 and up only!


If your 89 has single pivot control arms, you need the complete K-member, control arms, knuckles, brackets, calipers OFF a 91 and up car, or use the 91 and up minivan but you'll need to buy new wheel bearings/rotors OR find a Shelby Z or Grand Mini with 11 inch brakes and swap over the knuckle and on the Mini, the wheel hub.

If your 89 has the dual pivot stamped control arms, then all you need is the 91 and up control arms, knuckles, calipers, adapters and rotors.

[Tony Hanna]

Well crap! I thought it sounded too good to be true that it would be a simple caliper/bracket/rotor swap. Looks like I'll be going the SLH route after all.

[Vigo]

on an 89 you can get the knuckles and calipers from an 89 or 90 11" brake car and buy new rotors.. its just that 89-90 11" brake cars are hard to find in junkyards.

[Tony Hanna]

on an 89 you can get the knuckles and calipers from an 89 or 90 11" brake car and buy new rotors.. its just that 89-90 11" brake cars are hard to find in junkyards.

Right, that's why I was hoping Simon's method could be applied to an '89. Not much in the junkyards around here aside from a bunch of TI, TBI, and v6 stuff.:( I figure the SLH route will be fine for how I drive. I was interested in the 11" brakes more for better resistance to warping rotors than for increased stopping power.

Thanks,
Tony

[turbovanman²]

I have some brackets and calipers for sale, $45 plus shipping, see here-

http://www.turbo-mopar.com/forums/showthread.php?t=30821

[Vigo]

getting the pricier rotors makes a difference on warpage.. the cheapest ones warp more/easier in my experience... but i DO love $12 rotors anyway :p

[contraption22]

getting the pricier rotors makes a difference on warpage.. the cheapest ones warp more/easier in my experience... but i DO love $12 rotors anyway :p

I think you may be right. I did get the cheapies this time. Maybe I will try the better ones before yarding and not being able to fit 14" rims anymore.

[Tony Hanna]

I'd say that's my problem as well. I've been running the Advance/Autozone instawarp crap. Got a recommendation for better quality rotors?

I've also been eyeing the drilled/slotted rotors you can get on Ebay for our cars. I don't know if they'll shed heat any better and be more resistant to warping or not. Might give them a try when I get into the brakes on the Spirit if nobody has anything bad to say about the quality.

[turbovanman²]

I've tried 2 brands of Ebay slotted and CD rotors, so far, so good. Both aren't Ebay sellers anymore, :(

The R1 Concepts look like a good deal, :nod:


http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/DODGE-SPIRIT-90-Brake-Rotors-PREMIUM-D-S-Frnt_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQ_trkparmsZ72Q3a1019Q7c39Q3a 1Q7c66Q3a2Q7c65Q3a12Q7c240Q3a1318QQ_trksidZp3286Q2 ec0Q2em14QQhashZitem330273932903QQitemZ33027393290 3


http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/DODGE-SPIRIT-91-Brake-Rotors-PREMIUM-D-S-Rear_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQ_trkparmsZ72Q3a1019Q7c39Q3a 1Q7c66Q3a2Q7c65Q3a12Q7c240Q3a1318QQ_trksidZp3286Q2 ec0Q2em14QQhashZitem330273961172QQitemZ33027396117 2

[Tony Hanna]

Those look pretty good Simon. What brand/type of pads would you recommend running with those rotors for best performance?

[turbovanman²]

Those look pretty good Simon. What brand/type of pads would you recommend running with those rotors for best performance?

Hawk, Ake Bono, I even tried Tire Rack's Ceramics and they weren't bad.

[BF/STOCKER SPIRIT]

I BOUGHT A CARAVAN, BRAKE SET UP, FROM 'INMYSHADOW'
AWESOME PERSON AND HE PLAYED ,WITH ALL THE SET UPS
SIMPLE BOLT ON, THE CARAVAN CALIPERS ,AND THE BIGGER
24mm, MC, WORKS VERYWELL ON MY SPIRIT.

[black86glhs]

For just a regular rotor(no slots or holes) Wagner has to be damn near the best I've used. That being said, the only cheap rotors/drums I have had a problem with were the 11" drums on my chevy. After taking a thin slow cut on them, they are ok.