HEP issues with dist turning backwards!

[turbovanman²]

I didn't change anything and I got the usual 3-4 sparks then nothing, code 11. So I turned the HEP around and now no spark. So mocking it up, it looked like I could just swap the HEP connectors and fool the computer, so I removed the special tabs in the connectors and swapped black to gray and vice versa, no spark. Again, looked at how it all works and it looks like I have to slighly reindex the rotor on the reluctor wheel as now, it looks like the rotor is aprox 1/4-1/2 from pointing at the wire terminal.

Am I right or any other input. I'll redo it on Monday.

[bakes]

is that no spark from the coil or no spark to the correct hole?
are the injectors still pulsing ?

[bakes]

i just went into shop and pulled one from the sundance to get an idea of what you looking at when you open a hep up the pick ups are not 180 more like 170 swapping the leads should work suspect problem is esle were loss of gound or 5v ref

[turbovanman²]

i just went into shop and pulled one from the sundance to get an idea of what you looking at when you open a hep up the pick ups are not 180 more like 170 swapping the leads should work suspect problem is esle were loss of gound or 5v ref

I am turning the distributor backwards and the items worked fine when run in the normal direction. I brought it home so when I get 5 minutes tomorrow, I'll have another look but I think I am on the right track.

[turbovanman²]

Nevermind, found the info I need. :D

[bakes]

what was the info?

[turbovanman²]

I was right switching the HEP connectors but I have to reindex the pickup wheel.

[Clay]

yeah if you go read when "omniboy" did this a few years back (may be on the other site) he said he had to switch some wiring, and reindex some parts.

[turbovanman²]

yeah if you go read when "omniboy" did this a few years back (may be on the other site) he said he had to switch some wiring, and reindex some parts.

I found the thread where he posted what he did, just couldn't remember who did it and where and the dumb part is, its in one of my threads, lol!

He switched wires around, I just removed the plastic limiters so to speak on the factory connectors so you can switch the HEP connectors around, so black to white and white to black. I mocked it all up and wasn't sure about the reluctor wheel.

http://www.turbo-mopar.com/forums/showthread.php?t=22307&highlight=hep

[turbovanman²]

ARGGGGGGGGGGGG, :censored:

WTF is going on, I did the reluctor wheel mod per Omniboy, no spark, so I switched the HEP connectors back and now spark but backfiring. This is really starting to piss me off.

[overlordsshadow]

What are you even trying to do? Running an old hep and disty on ure t3?

[turbovanman²]

What are you even trying to do? Running an old hep and disty on ure t3?

Check the link in post 9

[black86glhs]

Simon, I know you cut out the alignment notch, but are the terminal locations different between the 2 connectors and the harness connectors.....something to think about?

[turbovanman²]

Simon, I know you cut out the alignment notch, but are the terminal locations different between the 2 connectors and the harness connectors.....something to think about?

I don't know anymore, I had to put the HEP back to stock otherwise no spark. I am starting to loose interest. Anyone want a partially finished TIII Minivan, :(

[zin]

I am starting to loose interest. Anyone want a partially finished TIII Minivan, :(

"I'd buy that for a dollar!" :D

[turbovanman²]

Still no go so I went back to the start, redid everything I thought he mentioned and still no start, just backfiring thru the exhaust. So I hook up my timing light and have buddy crank it, I line up TDC and now have #1 firing at the right spot, still boom. So I check injector pulse and no wonder, its firing at the same time as the spark????? I am so lost now.

[bakes]

looked up the pick up and cam sync pinouts on alldata, plugs wiring is the same positions are the same on engine harness end should swap ok. It should run. Do you have a spare HEP just to try ?

[turbovanman²]

looked up the pick up and cam sync pinouts on alldata, plugs wiring is the same positions are the same on engine harness end should swap ok. It should run. Do you have a spare HEP just to try ?

Its not the HEP, the computer is firing the spark and injector pulse at the same time????? :confused:

[MiniMopar]

I think that is expected on batch-fired electronics. Are you still running the SMEC?

[bakes]

does the order of the injector need to be swaped as well

[bakes]

do you have a pic of where you index the shutter wheel?

[turbovanman²]

do you have a pic of where you index the shutter wheel?

The thread I linked earlier, its the same as that, I think page 2. I think the window is in the wrong place.

I did everything he said and it just doesn't work. I am going to calm down and mock it up again tomorrow. I got his number but he hasn't called me back, hopefully tomorrow, fingers crossed.

[turbovanman²]

I think that is expected on batch-fired electronics. Are you still running the SMEC?

I would have thought that the injector pulse would come before the spark as there syncing #1. I will check another running turbo car tomorrow and see what that does.


does the order of the injector need to be swaped as well

I wouldn't think so, its still being fired in the same firing order, 1-3-4-2, just backwards.

[bakes]

i have a hard time trying to figure why in those pics if the rotor tip and open window shudder are aligned up . a stock dist. normal dir. the window is about 11* lets say right side of the rotor tip ,know if you mod that dist should the open window be 11* to the left side of that rotor tip?

[turbovanman²]

i have a hard time trying to figure why in those pics if the rotor tip and open window shudder are aligned up . a stock dist. normal dir. the window is about 11* lets say right side of the rotor tip ,know if you mod that dist should the open window be 11* to the left side of that rotor tip?

Well the theory is everything is turning backwards and you reverse the HEP so what he did was move the shutter wheel to the other side, so in theory, that should now all be in reverse but something has gone wrong on my end. I hope he calls me tomorrow because I think he's forgotten to tell us something.

[black86glhs]

Simon, I know what it shows in Jon's pictures, but I think the shutter wheel needs to move counter-clockwise 1 hole, not clockwise(compared to stock). Stock the shutter wheel points at the 10-10:30ish area and rotates clockwise. If you look at the next blade(counter-clockwise), its trailing edge is right at the edge of the lower sensor.
Now if you move the shutter wheel 1 hole counter-clockwise, look at the next blade(clockwise). Its trailing edge is right at the edge if the sensor, also. Remember, you are now turning the shutter wheel counter-clockwise......basically the same setup as stock, but going the opposite way.
This all works because you have moved the sync from the top to the bottom. Which is now in the correct spot for it to turn backwards and work. Let me know what you think.

[turbovanman²]

Simon, I know what it shows in Jon's pictures, but I think the shutter wheel needs to move counter-clockwise 1 hole, not clockwise(compared to stock). Stock the shutter wheel points at the 10-10:30ish area and rotates clockwise. If you look at the next blade(counter-clockwise), its trailing edge is right at the edge of the lower sensor.
Now if you move the shutter wheel 1 hole counter-clockwise, look at the next blade(clockwise). Its trailing edge is right at the edge if the sensor, also. Remember, you are now turning the shutter wheel counter-clockwise......basically the same setup as stock, but going the opposite way.
This all works because you have moved the sync from the top to the bottom. Which is now in the correct spot for it to turn backwards and work. Let me know what you think.

I got ahold of Omniboy today so I will play more later.

I also see what your saying but I think I moved the shutter wheel to the OTHER side, which is what is needed when going backwards. I'll report back later.

[rbryant]

So are you swapping the wiring to avoid flipping the entire HEP 180 degrees?

-Rich

[turbovanman²]

So are you swapping the wiring to avoid flipping the entire HEP 180 degrees?

-Rich

You have to flip and swap as your moving the trigger.

[turbovanman²]

After countless friggin hours, it turns out I have no compression, turns out my valves are being held open due to them being too long. Its really along story on what the issue is but needless to say, the head is coming off again, :( :censored:

[black86glhs]

Oh poo!!!!!!!

[rbryant]

You have to flip and swap as your moving the trigger.

Ahh ok. I Missed the wire swapping part. I obviously haven't fired mine up yet.

-Rich

[Clay]

ok simon, I have time ;) , so what caused your issue?

[turbovanman²]

It runs, sort of. Got the head repaired by another machine shop and they were way out. Anyhow, just fired it up, it runs but very roughly and its missing. I'll play more tomorrow, off home to bed.

[bakes]

Thats good to here . Think you have it in tune for next friday night drags?

[turbovanman²]

Thats good to here . Think you have it in tune for next friday night drags?

Not sure, depends on what I find or get done.

[black86glhs]

Simon, quit playing with that d@mn bike and get that van runnin!!!:p
I take it you haven't messed around with it much since getting the head back on?

[turbovanman²]

Did the old pull a plug wire trick and #2 was dead, compression test was 150-0-150-150. Leakdown showed it was coming out of the exhaust so undid the rocker arm bolts and fixed so once again, the valves are still to f*cking long. I even gave them a stock head to compare too. This is really becoming a joke, :censored: I bet you could remove 1/8 off the valve stems as the lifters are at max compression, :mad:

[black86glhs]

Did the old pull a plug wire trick and #2 was dead, compression test was 150-0-150-150. Leakdown showed it was coming out of the exhaust so undid the rocker arm bolts and fixed so once again, the valves are still to f*cking long. I even gave them a stock head to compare too. This is really becoming a joke, :censored: I bet you could remove 1/8 off the valve stems as the lifters are at max compression, :mad:
I didn't know you had after market valves installed. They didn't understand the idea of making them the same height as stock ones???:rolleyes::banghead:

[turbovanman²]

I didn't know you had after market valves installed. They didn't understand the idea of making them the same height as stock ones???:rolleyes::banghead:

They are stock valves but with all the head work and seats, the valves sit higher up. I managed to grind the top of the valves off flat, in the van so we'll see in a bit what goes on.

[turbovanman²]

Its alive, alive. I messed up slightly, I double shimmed one lifter by accident, cylinder #2 of course. Just fired it up, smooth baby smooth, :partywoot: :partywoot: Ok, my interest to finish is back on, head home for a bbq and all nighter on Monday, :thumb:

[black86glhs]

Nice work. Are you using the DIS or the distributor?

[turbovanman²]

Distributor, follow the link in my sig for pics. Can't use DIS with a dizzy, :confused: ;)

[black86glhs]

I know that. That is why I was asking which one you used to get it running again.
Did you set it up the way Omniboy had it?

[turbovanman²]

I know that. That is why I was asking which one you used to get it running again.
Did you set it up the way Omniboy had it?

Yep, just moved the wheel one hole and changed the firing order, reversed the HEP. Fired right up with the lifter and valve stems ground down, funny how that works, :eyebrows:

[black86glhs]

Very nice. Glad to hear it is up and running again. Especially on the distributor. Nice Job.:thumb:

[turbovanman²]

Thanks, alot of work, I almost gave up after the valves were still too long on Friday. If I couldn't have ground them down in the van, I was done.

[black86glhs]

I really do understand. I've had the Omni since 2002. After I found the rings toast on it last time, I almost pushed it out on the street. Read my post from earlier tonight and you can see I am feeling much better now!!!