Why don't I have 11" brakes on my 92 Turbo Lebaron GTC?

[thrashercharged]

This pertains to the 92 Turbo Lebaron GTC with T1/A568 I'm resurrecting. The car has 112K miles and still had the original rotors - I know because both sides still had the factory retaining clips and were paper thin and warped like you wouldn't believe. Strangely though, the pads seemed relatively new - why someone would change the pads and not replace the rotors, especially in the shape they were in, I don't know.

Being a GTC with factory 16" rims (205-55-16) and rear disk brakes, every parts store and even the dealer said it should have 11" rotors, but they're only 10.25". So what's the deal? Was 11" rotors a separate option? Apparently there was both a "Sports" and "Performance" suspension option for this model - which was the better one (better meaning more geared for handling) and how can I tell what I have? Is there an RPO code I should look for? Actually, maybe I should ask first, does Chrysler have different codes for various options, and are they printed on a sticker somewhere?

Since I don't have 11" brakes, what's the easiest (and cheapest!) way to put them on? I think it would be minivan brakes, right? Do all minivans have the large brakes (i.e. which ones should I look for in a junkyard?), and what parts doe I need from the donor? Rotors I'd obviously buy new unless the donor ones look really good. Calipers I could turn in as cores. I know I'd need the caliper brackets. What about the master cylinder? Anything else?

Thanks for any help!

[DC Turismo]

I have the entire setup you need from an 89 Daytona Shelby my brother and I just stripped. PM me.

[GLHNSLHT2]

The 89 MC, prop valve, and rear's would work. The Fronts are different though.

[TopDollar69]

Do not use the 89-90 style 11 inch front knuckles unless you want your wheels pushed back further in the wheel wells. The easiest thing to do, would be to find a 91-95 LeBaron GTC, or a 91-93 Daytona with the 11 inch brakes at a junk yard. If you already have rear disks, the master cylinder is the same, and I'm about 75% sure the proportioning valve is the same also. You will need the rear backing plates, calipers, rear rotors, front calipers, front caliper mounting brackets, and front rotors. I would still like to see a picture of what you have, if you can get one.

[capev86]

so your gtc has 10-1/4 front rotors and solid rear disc? if it has vented rear disc but not the 11 fronts, someone changed something or it was a mistake at the factory. vented rears won't make much difference in performance (but add weight) but the 11" fronts will be a good improvement.

easy way to upgrade is to find a 91-95 grand caravan with 15 inch rims. you just need the calipers and caliper brackets (same exact part as the spirit/daytona rt). but you will need the buy the correct rotors as the caravan rotors are drilled for a larger lug pattern!

[thrashercharged]

Thanks for the answers and advice everyone. I'm not in the market for 11" rotors at this time since I just put new 10.25 on and new calipers - might as well wait until they wear out or warp. I was more curious why I have the smaller rotors and what exactly I needed from a minivan or Daytona to get 11" rotors.

I've posted photos of my brakes in my other thread (Slowest Lebaron) under the Original TD Cars section. Yes, I have the solid 10" rear rotors - good to know the vented 11" rears aren't worth it and just add weight. Rear brakes usually only contribute about 20% of the braking anyway.

Thanks for the reminder that the lug pattern is different on minivans! Do I really need different calipers for 11" rotors? I thought the calipers were the same, just the brackets are taller?

[minigts]

Do not use the 89-90 style 11 inch front knuckles unless you want your wheels pushed back further in the wheel wells. The easiest thing to do, would be to find a 91-95 LeBaron GTC, or a 91-93 Daytona with the 11 inch brakes at a junk yard. If you already have rear disks, the master cylinder is the same, and I'm about 75% sure the proportioning valve is the same also. You will need the rear backing plates, calipers, rear rotors, front calipers, front caliper mounting brackets, and front rotors. I would still like to see a picture of what you have, if you can get one.

Are the spindles not centered on the hub or is the ball joint not centered on the hub or something? Or is the strut mount not centered?

Does someone have a picture of this?

[TopDollar69]

I think that it is caused by the ball joint hole not being in the same location on the 91 up knuckles, as the 89-90 11 inch rotor knuckles. The ball joint location is pushed back further on the 91 up cast control arms, so the simple solution is use matching year control arms with matching year knuckles. I will try to find a pic of a car with mismatched arms-knuckles.

[minigts]

I guess my question is, is the offset on the control arm or on the hub? When I look at a hub, the ball joint perch, the spindle and the strut mounting "arm" are usually lined up, I THINK. So I wasn't sure if the shift in the wheel position was caused by the hub or the control arm or if the hub was designed differently. A picture definitely would be worth a thousand words to me in this instance, so thanks for trying to locate a pic. :thumb:

[TopDollar69]

I read through some pretty old posts on Turbododge and it looks like both parts, the knuckle and the control arm are different on the 91 up units. The lower part of the 91 up knuckles where the ball joint is bolted in is raised up compared to the older ones, and the angle of the ball joint is different on the cast control arms, and is also raised up. This has been confirmed by Dave and Simon. I was not able to find any pictures though, sorry. I think csracer had pics posted once, but I can't find them now. It does seem to be a more common problem with the G body cars for some reason.

[minigts]

Oh so the wheels are tucked in more, so the solution would be a lower ET offset for the wheels? Is that the shift you are referring to? For some reason I was thinking it was shifting front to back, not in. :)

[turbovanman²]

Thanks for the answers and advice everyone. I'm not in the market for 11" rotors at this time since I just put new 10.25 on and new calipers - might as well wait until they wear out or warp. I was more curious why I have the smaller rotors and what exactly I needed from a minivan or Daytona to get 11" rotors.

I've posted photos of my brakes in my other thread (Slowest Lebaron) under the Original TD Cars section. Yes, I have the solid 10" rear rotors - good to know the vented 11" rears aren't worth it and just add weight. Rear brakes usually only contribute about 20% of the braking anyway.

Thanks for the reminder that the lug pattern is different on minivans! Do I really need different calipers for 11" rotors? I thought the calipers were the same, just the brackets are taller?

I think you got a base option, 10inch rotors all around, :nod:

On the van, ONLY the Grand got the larger bolt pattern or if it came from the factory with 15 inch wheels, otherwise 5x100, the same as yours. All 91 and cars and vans use the same knuckle, well almost, and to change from 10's to 11's, you simply get the correct caliper adapter bracket and caliper, larger rotors, done.


Are the spindles not centered on the hub or is the ball joint not centered on the hub or something? Or is the strut mount not centered?

Does someone have a picture of this?

91 and up knuckles have the ball joint pad moved down 1 inch and the control arm is different to take advantage of it.

[TopDollar69]

Just to clarify, what Simon said only applies to the front brakes. If you want to swap the rears, you will need the backing plates, calipers, and rotors. I'm curious, do 92 IROC R/Ts and Spirit R/Ts with ABS have the smaller rotors as well?