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Tony Hanna
05-17-2007, 11:05 AM
I've got a bunch of random questions about TIII engines and the cars they came in. Instead of continuing to clutter up the TIII section with a post for each question, I figured I'd just start one thread to ask them all as they come to me.:)

#1: I've been wondering this since I got the Spirit. It's obvious that a 16v engine is going to need to breathe a little better than an 8v. With that in mind, why the hell did Chrysler hang a turbo with a .48 exhaust side on it? It seems to me that the stock turbo on a TIII is about like a mitsu on a 2.5. In other words already near it's limit with the car in stock form. Maybe I'm wrong, but it doesn't make much sense to me.

#2: The tach in my Spirit works occasionally for a second and then quits. It almost seems as though the mechanism or needle is binding up on something. I'd like to pull the instrument cluster out and check to see if that's the case. What all is involved? I've owned 5 TM's over the past few years, and haven't had the dash apart on any of them other than changing a radio, so I'm not even sure where to begin.

#3 Were there any MP computers available for the R/T, and if so are they still available or ns1? If they're ns1, does anybody have a copy of the .bin file so I could burn a chip with the MP cal on it? Better yet, would somebody be willing to burn the cal to a chip and mail it to me? Of course I'd be willing to compensate for time and the chip.:)

#4 Are the TIII valve cover gaskets a dealer/vendor item or has anybody had any luck finding them at a parts store?

#5 A '91 Spirit R/T should have 11" front rotors right? I need to order a set, but I don't want to jack it up and pull a wheel just to measure. I'd rather wait until I have the parts in hand.

That's it for now. I'm sure there will be more to come.
Thanks in Advance,
Tony

Blue Iroc R/T
05-17-2007, 12:19 PM
#4 Are the TIII valve cover gaskets a dealer/vendor item or has anybody had any luck finding them at a parts store?

#5 A '91 Spirit R/T should have 11" front rotors right? I need to order a set, but I don't want to jack it up and pull a wheel just to measure. I'd rather wait until I have the parts in hand.

That's it for now. I'm sure there will be more to come.
Thanks in Advance,
Tony

#4; The TIII Valver Cover Gaskets are a Dealer ONLY part. They were out of stock for a while, but last year they made another run of 1000 pcs. So, you might want to get some while they are still available. However, the design of the gaskets is pretty good and they ARE re-usable.

#5; I believe the Spirit R/T's did have the 11" brakes, but since I have never owned one, I will let someone else confirm that for you.

turbovanmanČ
05-17-2007, 12:37 PM
I've got a bunch of random questions about TIII engines and the cars they came in. Instead of continuing to clutter up the TIII section with a post for each question, I figured I'd just start one thread to ask them all as they come to me.:)

#1: I've been wondering this since I got the Spirit. It's obvious that a 16v engine is going to need to breathe a little better than an 8v. With that in mind, why the hell did Chrysler hang a turbo with a .48 exhaust side on it? It seems to me that the stock turbo on a TIII is about like a mitsu on a 2.5. In other words already near it's limit with the car in stock form. Maybe I'm wrong, but it doesn't make much sense to me.

Its called no lag, makes for a nice streetable car.




#3 Were there any MP computers available for the R/T, and if so are they still available or ns1? If they're ns1, does anybody have a copy of the .bin file so I could burn a chip with the MP cal on it? Better yet, would somebody be willing to burn the cal to a chip and mail it to me? Of course I'd be willing to compensate for time and the chip.:)

None from MP but Cindy has a couple.




#4 Are the TIII valve cover gaskets a dealer/vendor item or has anybody had any luck finding them at a parts store?

Cindy has them and well and Fredericksons on Ebay. I am going to use RTV and let it setup, I don't want to spend that kind of money.




#5 A '91 Spirit R/T should have 11" front rotors right? I need to order a set, but I don't want to jack it up and pull a wheel just to measure. I'd rather wait until I have the parts in hand.

That's it for now. I'm sure there will be more to come.
Thanks in Advance,
Tony

Correct. I got some nice zinc coated, CD rotors off Ebay, around $60-$70 for the pair.

Tony Hanna
05-17-2007, 12:40 PM
Thanks Ralph!
Hopefully somebody can confirm #5 so I can go ahead and order the rotors. The brakes are all that's keeping me from getting it inspected and 100% legal to drive.:)

turbovanmanČ
05-17-2007, 01:36 PM
Thanks Ralph!
Hopefully somebody can confirm #5 so I can go ahead and order the rotors. The brakes are all that's keeping me from getting it inspected and 100% legal to drive.:)


Ahem, are you blind? see my post, :p

Tony Hanna
05-17-2007, 01:42 PM
Ahem, are you blind? see my post, :p

Check the post times. You beat me to the punch. I hadn't seen your post before I posted that one.:)
Thanks Simon!
Tony

Tony Hanna
05-17-2007, 01:56 PM
Just thought of another.
#6: Where can I get red wrinkle paint that's close to the stock red on the valve covers?
Brand, part# and store where purchased please.
Thanks,
Tony

turbovanmanČ
05-17-2007, 03:53 PM
I have some VHT SP-204-C

its supposed to be close. I haven't painted mine yet so I don't have any more info, :nod:

Tony Hanna
05-17-2007, 04:24 PM
I have some VHT SP-204-C

its supposed to be close. I haven't painted mine yet so I don't have any more info, :nod:

Thanks Simon! Do you know offhand if any of the chain stores (Advance, Autozone, Napa) carry VHT? I'll have to see who sells the stuff...
Thanks Again,
Tony

turbovanmanČ
05-17-2007, 04:36 PM
They should carrry it, Jeg's, Summit do.

Tony Hanna
05-17-2007, 04:48 PM
Thanks, I'll check it out. I'd prefer to buy it locally if possible (no sense in paying shipping if I don't have to) if not, I'll try Summit or Jegs.

Tony Hanna
05-17-2007, 06:08 PM
And another...
#7 Does the TIII swingvalve housing use the standard Garrett 5 bolt pattern? In other words, if I were to pick up some random hybrid turbo with the standard 5 bolt turbine housing, could I bolt the swingvalve off of my stock turbo on it and run the stock downpipe?

iTurbo
05-17-2007, 08:47 PM
No, the TIII swingvalve is integrated into the turbine housing kinda like the TI Mitsu turbo. It uses a standard 4-bolt turbine flange to mount to the manifold, but the turbine discharge flange is a three bolt setup that is unlike any other turbocharger I have seen. No standard Ford/Chrysler swingvalve/O2 housing will work with the TIII turbocharger.

Tony Hanna
05-17-2007, 09:41 PM
No, the TIII swingvalve is integrated into the turbine housing kinda like the TI Mitsu turbo. It uses a standard 4-bolt turbine flange to mount to the manifold, but the turbine discharge flange is a three bolt setup that is unlike any other turbocharger I have seen. No standard Ford/Chrysler swingvalve/O2 housing will work with the TIII turbocharger.

Thanks Jeremy, I figured as much, but I wasn't sure. BTW, did you get my PM about the transmission? I saw over on TD where you were looking into running a 523 on a TIII a couple years ago and I'm curious if you ended up going through with it and what's involved?
Thanks Again,
Tony

turbovanmanČ
05-17-2007, 11:17 PM
And another...
#7 Does the TIII swingvalve housing use the standard Garrett 5 bolt pattern? In other words, if I were to pick up some random hybrid turbo with the standard 5 bolt turbine housing, could I bolt the swingvalve off of my stock turbo on it and run the stock downpipe?


What Jeremy said. To run another turbo on a TIII, you need a T3 flange and then you can either run a 5 bolt housing and buy the FM Elbow if available or V-band etc.

Lotashelbys
05-17-2007, 11:28 PM
I have some VHT SP-204-C

its supposed to be close. I haven't painted mine yet so I don't have any more info, :nod:

Simon is right the VHT will get you close but if you spray over it with a PRB touch-up spray you will get it as close to stock as I have been able to. Here is a pic of how close it is. The top is the bottom of a snorkel plate(preserved perfectly from the elements) and the bottom is one I did.......
http://i165.photobucket.com/albums/u45/lotashelbys/100_0874.jpg

Tony Hanna
05-17-2007, 11:47 PM
That looks nice!
I'm assuming if I use PRB as a top coat, then it's not really going to matter what color the wrinkle paint underneath is right? The reason I ask is that the only color wrinkle paint I can find locally is black.
Thanks,
Tony

86Shelby
05-18-2007, 12:07 AM
If you have an O'reilly auto parts near you they can order it. I have 3 more cans on the way. Next day delivery- no shipping charges. :) Go to VHTs website, there have a list of carriers for each state.

iTurbo
05-18-2007, 01:09 AM
Thanks Jeremy, I figured as much, but I wasn't sure. BTW, did you get my PM about the transmission? I saw over on TD where you were looking into running a 523 on a TIII a couple years ago and I'm curious if you ended up going through with it and what's involved?
Thanks Again,
Tony

Yup, I got it but it looked like everything I knew was already gone over by other people (that know more than I do) already. I decided not to modify an A523 for my Spirit R/T and instead got a A568/A523 hybrid from Cliff to replace the bad A568. I think Jackson and Cliff have a jig..

Tony Hanna
05-18-2007, 02:53 AM
Thanks Ray.
Unfortunately no O'reilly's around here, just Advance, Autozone, and Napa (No Auto Parts Available:) ).
Autozone does carry a very limited supply of VHT, but no red wrinkle paint. Maybe they can order it? I think I may try base coating it with the black wrinkle paint for texture, then going over it with the Duplicolor PRB equivalent, or maybe wrinkle, then gray primer, then the PRB if the black doesn't want to cover well. We'll see what happens.

Tony Hanna
05-18-2007, 03:06 AM
Yup, I got it but it looked like everything I knew was already gone over by other people (that know more than I do) already. I decided not to modify an A523 for my Spirit R/T and instead got a A568/A523 hybrid from Cliff to replace the bad A568. I think Jackson and Cliff have a jig..

Thanks Jeremy! I didn't see anything after that one thread, so I wasn't sure how far you got with it. I'm hopeful it'll work and last at least until I can afford to have the 568 rebuilt.
Who knows, a TBI 523 may prove to be a really good match to the TIII engine. It looks like 1st through 4th are significantly lower geared, so it might get the engine into the usable revs quicker.:thumb:
If I can get some of the bugs worked out, I may even try to drive it to SDAC.:) Since I have the 568 to check it against, I don't imagine it'll be too hard to build a jig. If I could get Jackson or Cliff to post a picture, that would be a big help, but I'm pretty confident I can manage to get the hole in the right spot.
Thanks Again,
Tony

Tony Hanna
05-18-2007, 12:29 PM
#8
I see that some of the Spirit R/T's were offered with an "overhead convenience package". Mine wasn't but I really like the idea. Since the headliner is missing anyway, I'm considering trying to find a car in a junkyard that has this option to grab the headliner and overhead console out of. The question is what should I be looking for? I know the headliner will have to come out of a Spirit or Acclaim, but was the same overhead console used in other models? Also, how much of a pain will it be to wire up the thermometer in the overhead console? I'm assuming signal from a sensor, switched +, ground, and a + feed from the headlight switch for night dimming...
Any thoughts or advice would be appreciated.

turbovanmanČ
05-18-2007, 01:22 PM
Thanks Jeremy! I didn't see anything after that one thread, so I wasn't sure how far you got with it. I'm hopeful it'll work and last at least until I can afford to have the 568 rebuilt.
Who knows, a TBI 523 may prove to be a really good match to the TIII engine. It looks like 1st through 4th are significantly lower geared, so it might get the engine into the usable revs quicker.:thumb:
If I can get some of the bugs worked out, I may even try to drive it to SDAC.:) Since I have the 568 to check it against, I don't imagine it'll be too hard to build a jig. If I could get Jackson or Cliff to post a picture, that would be a big help, but I'm pretty confident I can manage to get the hole in the right spot.
Thanks Again,
Tony


I've driven one, trust me, you dont' want it getting into the revs quicker, ;)

Tony Hanna
05-18-2007, 01:46 PM
I've driven one, trust me, you dont' want it getting into the revs quicker, ;)

Traction issues!!??;)

iTurbo
05-18-2007, 02:05 PM
The stock A568 is geared pretty steep (3.85 FD). Like any other TD, 1st gear can be pretty useless, especially when you're using a grainger valve to control boost and you have to feather the gas to avoid too much boost. I have a 3.50 FD and OBX in my R/T now...much better. Seems to let the car 'stretch it's legs'.

Tony Hanna
05-18-2007, 02:46 PM
That makes sense. I figured with the 16v liking the upper rpms a little better, the lower 1st through 4th of the 523 (TBI 523's final drive is the same as stock @ 3.85) might make for a little faster acceleration. I wasn't taking into account traction problems. Guess I should have been. Oh well, it's nothing a slightly laggy turbo won't help. Maybe I'll end up with something that'll break the tires loose from a roll at interstate speeds. That would be fun. Usless, but fun.:)