Minivan lowering solution?

[whywoody]

Ok,I know there has been lots of threads about lowering your van,but this one is a new thought on the front end.
*This would take alot of work*
I have been looking at lowering mine with different struts and spring combo's,but don't like the low pan and axle problems.My thoughts were to raise the engine/trans as we have alot of room to the hood.Passenger side mount would be easy to raise,front would probably have to be made using sections of the original,and the drivers side might need the 'pocket' that is spotted to the frame to be removed and a new one fabed with the height ajusted.This side might be easier with a 2nd Gen van as the 'pocket' for the mount is alot taller which may allow you to modify it to bolt an early style small mount up higher.It looks to me that there is enough room above the axle to the frame rail for wheel travel,although I don't know how much travel the struts have exactly...:confused:
I know this would be a big job,but I am planning to swap my engine/trans into a 2nd Gen van shell and think these mods would be achievable while the engine is out.
Thoughts:eyebrows: ????

[turbovanman]

Personally, your overthinking it. Mines lowered 3" in the front and 3.5" in the rear and NO axle problems or vibrations. Granted I am lifting it back up 1/2 to 1 inch but thats due to load carrying loss.
Also, the oil pan is still way off the ground I have never hit anything with it, and I probably have 60,000 KM on this combo, :thumb: :partywoot:

[ohiorob]

sounds like a lot of work. my main concern on lowering the mini van would be the angle of the bottom control arms. how would it affect handling?

[turbovanman]

Rob, the control arms are slightly above parallel and the handling is unreal. After I figured out the correct combination of parts, it rides firm but not bone jarring like my first setup. With the large front sway bar and 2nd Gen rear sway bar, she handles pretty good. I can't wait to put the coilovers in, these struts I have in right now are pretty well worn out. When the snow melts, I will put them in with Johnny's new cast control arm bushings.

[5sp. mini]

i,ve got to chime in here i,ve ran mine lower with the g body set up but i,ve used all new parts and new ball joints and lower a arm bushings also i left the rear alone just new shocks and mine rides and handle just as well or beter the stock. going on 3years now/ i was going to do brains but he broke somthig ease.i set camber at 1/4neg and 1/64 toe in. i have bottem the left side axle out on hard right hand turns. i was running 225/50/16 on the front abount the size of the 17 on rob,s van. hold off till i do brians and drive his. alan

[turbovanman]

Running P225/55R16 tires, -3/4 camber and 0 toe, never had a shaft pull out.

[whywoody]

Personally, your overthinking it. Mines lowered 3" in the front and 3.5" in the rear and NO axle problems or vibrations. Granted I am lifting it back up 1/2 to 1 inch but thats due to load carrying loss.
Also, the oil pan is still way off the ground I have never hit anything with it, and I probably have 60,000 KM on this combo, :thumb: :partywoot:

Yeah,I'm sure your right Simon.I haven't tried any combo myself,so I guess that would be a smarter plan:nod: .My van is getting terrible for rust,hardly any of the power options work (door harnesses..),and is generally a heap of crap other than the engine etc lol,so I am getting myself aimed at building up a better van and was thinking of anything I would do while the engine was out.

[5sp. mini]

never had a axle pull out or any axle problem, vans been to lots of mopar shows and is my DD. i have turn the boost down from 14 to 7 to help the old 2.2 make it longer, as i have other stuff i want to work on. alan

[Dave]

I'll let you guys know how mine turns out after Al's done to it. Give me about a week or two.

[turbovanman]

never had a axle pull out or any axle problem, vans been to lots of mopar shows and is my DD. i have turn the boost down from 14 to 7 to help the old 2.2 make it longer, as i have other stuff i want to work on. alan

I thought thats what you said but you said it rubbed, so I will change my statement to "Never had an axle bottom out or rub" :p

I hear you on the rust, so far its just my 1/4's but with the snow and salt, they've spread about an inch more on each side. I cut the 1/4's off my spare Mini so now just need my brother to put them in.

[ohiorob]

whywoody you got me thinking. my van is lowerd about 3+'' looking underneath the motor sits alittle to low for me and looking how the engine is mounted I think it would be kinda eazy to raise it 1'' to 2''. then I started to think about raising the hole K-frame too ;)

[turbovanman]

whywoody you got me thinking. my van is lowerd about 3+'' looking underneath the motor sits alittle to low for me and looking how the engine is mounted I think it would be kinda eazy to raise it 1'' to 2''. then I started to think about raising the hole K-frame too ;)

Raising the K-frame, holy shitt, that would be some serious work. :(

[Dave]

Raising the K-frame, holy shitt, that would be some serious work. :(

It would be a cold day in hell to get me to help Rob with something like that. I feel bad for Sean. :thumb:

BTW Rob, I wonder if the SRT4 motor sits lower in your van than our 8vs. I guess it would depend on how you fabbed the mounts, but yours like pretty stock.

[turbovanman]

It might be needed for the SRT swap but Rob would have to measure. IMHO, not needed for a stock motor'd van, meaning the block it came with.

[whywoody]

I'm sure I would be fine to lower it the regular way,and never have a problem,but I'm a little bad for creating challenges for myself :o and I know that this thought of raising the engine will eat at me until I either try it,or come up with a REAL reason to let it go other than 'alot of work':nod: .
I seem to be able to spend hours on something that's not realy worth doing,as long as it's CHEAP,oops sorry,I meant thrifty lol!
I think someone else should try it first,then let me know if it worked and was worth the effort!:thumb:

[ohiorob]

I'm sure I would be fine to lower it the regular way,and never have a problem,but I'm a little bad for creating challenges for myself :o and I know that this thought of raising the engine will eat at me until I either try it,or come up with a REAL reason to let it go other than 'alot of work':nod: .
I seem to be able to spend hours on something that's not realy worth doing,as long as it's CHEAP,oops sorry,I meant thrifty lol!
I think someone else should try it first,then let me know if it worked and was worth the effort!:thumb:

I'm the same way. once I get a idea in my head it won't go away :mad:

[Dave]

I'm the same way. once I get a idea in my head it won't go away :mad:

JUST LET IT GO MAN! :p

[ohiorob]

JUST LET IT GO MAN! :p

sorry it's to late;) the next time i get a chance to work on the minivan I'm going to change the suspension. front and back. I'm going to raise the motor about 1 1/2 to 2'' and raise the K-frame about 2'' and for the back I'm going to raise the mounting points of the springs at the body. 3 days work and it's free :thumb:

[turbovanman]

I'd be interested to see how your going to raise the K-member. Now so where on the same wavelength, are you talking about lifting it AWAY from the body or putting it closer to the body? If you making it away, then that would help, put the rack tie rods more parallel and also put the control arms back to parallel. That would be easy to do, all you need is some spacers and longer studs. :thumb:

[ohiorob]

I guess what I'm trying to do is drop the body down over the suspenion.

[turbovanman]

I guess what I'm trying to do is drop the body down over the suspenion.


Gotcha, :nod:

[whywoody]

I was looking under one of our company minivans today,'96 base model 3ltr egg shaped 3rd gen,and they have a very interesting K frame set-up,very different to ours.I also noticed that they have the same rear axle as ours,but with a panhard bar(?) and single leaf springs fitted.
I am hoping it will be at the shop tomorrow,so I can run it over the pit and take some pics. The shop pit is about 80ft long,so I'll run mine on at the same time,should be great for comparing possible swaps.
I would be interested in swaping my engine/trans. into one of these too.

[turbovanman]

I was looking under one of our company minivans today,'96 base model 3ltr egg shaped 3rd gen,and they have a very interesting K frame set-up,very different to ours.I also noticed that they have the same rear axle as ours,but with a panhard bar(?) and single leaf springs fitted.
I am hoping it will be at the shop tomorrow,so I can run it over the pit and take some pics. The shop pit is about 80ft long,so I'll run mine on at the same time,should be great for comparing possible swaps.
I would be interested in swaping my engine/trans. into one of these too.


Yeah, they have a weird K-member setup, its also made out of aluminium.

If I you, I would sell your current engine and just drop a 2.4L turbo engine in, that will be a piece of cake, :thumb:

[ohiorob]

I bought a 96 van with the 2.4 and a bad tranny that i was going to drop the srt-4 in but something about that old first gen. look changed my mine plus it's wired for turbo:thumb:
a 3rd gen. turbo van would be cool. I think Hahns racecraft makes a piggy back fuel system that will work with that motor and stock wiring. it only comes on at boost.

[turbovanman]

Thats what I would do if my van got wrecked, buy a newer one and do the SRT4 swap. :D

[whywoody]

I guess we've got a little off topic lol!
I think I'll look into a 2.4ltr 3rd gen van,although 3ltr's would be alot easier to find,and go from there.I will continue to run my current ride,until the right one comes along.Like you spoke of Rob,something with a problem that writes it off for the owner,but is perfect for a project.I don't really like the PT's,prefer the practical van.Around here the 1st gen vans are getting real rotten from the salt and long winters,and owners that had no interest in preserving them as they are 'just minivans' lol.

[5sp. mini]

we seem to be running out of them here too but it,s because big psi bought them all up lol ya the only bad part is the 3th gen,s never were stick shifts, i would miss my 5sp mini. but there is hope with hydrawlick clutchs. alan

[5sp. mini]

well we droped bryans van sat and new shocks on the rear looked lots better then before. after he left i called him and we were talking abount how it handled. the turning was increased big time but like on mine it you are pulling hard in a curve it just hangs in there but when you let off the gas is were it get a little hard to handle. remember this is at higher speeds and i warned him to watch out for that, i,ve had mine in some real tight spots.we will have to find a way to lower the rear by removeing a leaf or 2. maybe after i get my f### truck back on the road this summer i will try that. but till then i have alot going on and don,t have time for that yet. we need pic,s bryan. alan

[ohiorob]

I'm lowering the rear by moving where the leaf spring mount to the body I should be done today. Bryan has some pics to show.

[Dave]

well we droped bryans van sat and new shocks on the rear looked lots better then before. after he left i called him and we were talking abount how it handled. the turning was increased big time but like on mine it you are pulling hard in a curve it just hangs in there but when you let off the gas is were it get a little hard to handle. remember this is at higher speeds and i warned him to watch out for that, i,ve had mine in some real tight spots.we will have to find a way to lower the rear by removeing a leaf or 2. maybe after i get my f### truck back on the road this summer i will try that. but till then i have alot going on and don,t have time for that yet. we need pic,s bryan. alan

Ask and you shall receive. :) Thanks again for your help, Al.

Before:
http://www.turbo-mopar.com/forums/photopost/data/644/medium/IM0063101.JPG

After:
http://www.turbo-mopar.com/forums/photopost/data/644/medium/IM006461.JPG

http://www.turbo-mopar.com/forums/photopost/data/644/medium/IM006460.JPG

http://www.turbo-mopar.com/forums/photopost/data/644/medium/IM006458.JPG


I'm lowering the rear by moving where the leaf spring mount to the body I should be done today. Bryan has some pics to show.

Here are thos: Look how ugly Rob is. :eyebrows:

http://www.turbo-mopar.com/forums/photopost/data/647/medium/IM006453.JPG

Driver's side:
http://www.turbo-mopar.com/forums/photopost/data/647/medium/IM006454.JPG

Pass's side:
http://www.turbo-mopar.com/forums/photopost/data/647/medium/IM006455.JPG

[Dave]

Here are some better comparison side shots. Not the best they do the job. All we did was replace the struts with stock Daytona units, new van rear shocks, and van ball joints.

http://www.turbo-mopar.com/forums/photopost/data/644/medium/IM0062581.JPG

http://www.turbo-mopar.com/forums/photopost/data/644/medium/S5002139.JPG

[turbovanman]

So Bryan, all you did was lower the front?


Wow Rob, thats a shitload of work. Personally, I'll stick with my easy method, :nod:

[ohiorob]

So Bryan, all you did was lower the front?


Wow Rob, thats a shitload of work. Personally, I'll stick with my easy method, :nod:

A shitload is right. 3 days of hard work but to me it was worth it and it's all done :amen: looks nice :thumb: about 2 1/2'' - 2 1/4'' drop.

[turbovanman]

A shitload is right. 3 days of hard work but to me it was worth it and it's all done :amen: looks nice :thumb: about 2 1/2'' - 2 1/4'' drop.


DUDE, PICS? :thumb:

[BIGBRUDDA]

Rob, Now you can change your handle to SO-LO-ROB :D

[Dave]

Rob, Now you can change your handle to SO-LO-ROB :D

lmfao! :lol: :lol:

I'm getting pics for Rob soon.

Simon, yah that's all we did was lower the front. I'm hitting the exhaust off everything now. :banghead:

[turbovanman]

lmfao! :lol: :lol:

I'm getting pics for Rob soon.

Simon, yah that's all we did was lower the front. I'm hitting the exhaust off everything now. :banghead:

You've seen how low my van is, nothing hits. If you put your exhaust properly, you won't have any issues, :thumb:

[Dave]

Hope so... I went through a drive-thru car wash today and the exhaust was bangin' off everything!:(

[Dave]

Just an update. Rob was pulling the trans out of my van the other day and he noted that I had banged the trans pan and k-frame up pretty good.

The k-frame was hitting where the bushing sits for the control arm on both sides. I thought I was bottoming out the struts, but apparently that's not possible. With the stock 15" rims on 205/50/15's a van sits too low with G-body struts. :( Rob suggested some 225/50/15's. I hope that will bring it up a little higher.

[turbovanman]

Just an update. Rob was pulling the trans out of my van the other day and he noted that I had banged the trans pan and k-frame up pretty good.

The k-frame was hitting where the bushing sits for the control arm on both sides. I thought I was bottoming out the struts, but apparently that's not possible. With the stock 15" rims on 205/50/15's a van sits too low with G-body struts. :( Rob suggested some 225/50/15's. I hope that will bring it up a little higher.

50 series are too small on a van, if you must run 15 inch tires, you need a 60 or 65 series tire, especially if you've lowered it 3.5 inches.

[5sp. mini]

ya i was compairing 215/6015 to 215/6515 today at work/ those 205/5015 were off the rear of a rx7. i only gave them for the sprit he had. once he puts sum 60 on it it will be ok. what happen to the trans?alan

[Dave]

Al, these tires are going soon anyways as you saw the tread depth, I have some 205/60/15's laying around. Hopefully it wont look too ugly.

I wiped out the planetary ring I guess. That's what Rob tells me. That and 130,000 miles and never having a flush/fill just killed it.

[turbovanman]

205/60 is still a bit small, 215/60 should be the minimum. Planetary's are common to go on these trans so no biggie. Mine are welded up, :nod:

[fargo59]

i have 205/65/15's on my 92 van. when i put the pumpers on it, I'm going to go with 205/60/16, simply since they are very similar diameter, and are OEM for a sebring sedan, so they are a popular size. the van originally came with 195/75/14's.

[turbovanman]

i have 205/65/15's on my 92 van. when i put the pumpers on it, I'm going to go with 205/60/16, simply since they are very similar diameter, and are OEM for a sebring sedan, so they are a popular size. the van originally came with 195/75/14's.


I'll check at work but I think 205/65 is still small. I went with 225/55R16, slightly taller than stock, :thumb:

[fargo59]

I'll check at work but I think 205/65 is still small. I went with 225/55R16, slightly taller than stock, :thumb:

depends on weather or not it had 14's or 15's stock. the plus one rule works out that:
195/75/14 is the same as,
205/65/15
215/55/16 (205/60/16 is very close)

[turbovanman]

depends on weather or not it had 14's or 15's stock. the plus one rule works out that:
195/75/14 is the same as,
205/65/15
215/55/16 (205/60/16 is very close)

Yep, your right.

195/75R14, 205/65R15 are around 25.5 inches in diameter.
205/55R16 and 215/60R16 are around 25 inches
205/60R15 is around 24.7 inches and I couldn't find a spec for 215/55R16.
225/50R16 is around 25 inches

The P225/55R16's I run are around 25.7 inches, :nod:

[fargo59]

Yep, your right.

195/75R14, 205/65R15 are around 25.5 inches in diameter.
205/55R16 and 215/60R16 are around 25 inches
205/60R15 is around 24.7 inches and I couldn't find a spec for 215/55R16.
225/50R16 is around 25 inches

The P225/55R16's I run are around 25.7 inches, :nod:

i think we're both arguing but both on the same side. my van came with 195/75/14's (25.5" diameter) i then put 205/65/15's on it (25.5" diameter) now i have pumpers for it, so the plus one rule says 215/55/16's (25.3"), but I'm going with 205/60/16 (25.7"), the same diameter as your 225/55/16's according to bigcustomwheels.com's tire calculator. now you could step up to the 225/60/16's like on my intrepid (also crown vic's, impalas, etc) at 26.6 inch diameter. that ought to fill the wheel wells.

[turbovanman]

i think we're both arguing but both on the same side. my van came with 195/75/14's (25.5" diameter) i then put 205/65/15's on it (25.5" diameter) now i have pumpers for it, so the plus one rule says 215/55/16's (25.3"), but I'm going with 205/60/16 (25.7"), the same diameter as your 225/55/16's according to bigcustomwheels.com's tire calculator. now you could step up to the 225/60/16's like on my intrepid (also crown vic's, impalas, etc) at 26.6 inch diameter. that ought to fill the wheel wells.

Not arguing, I thought the tire you listed was too small, I stand corrected, ;)

Yeah, I tried the 225/60R16 and it was UGLY, :mecry:

[BARRON]

Yah.. I was going to say.. the profile is far too low. you need 205/65/15's to be with in factory specs.

[Vigo]

215/60r15 is pretty much the best compromise size for a 6.0 inch rim. i ran 2 sets in that size on my cars and liked it. 205/50r15s are sweet but not right for a van :(

[turbovanman]

215/60r15 is pretty much the best compromise size for a 6.0 inch rim.

I ran those on my van with Pizza wheels, :thumb:

[Dave]

If I switch from a 50 to a 60 profile it will only raise it .4". Not really worth $50 to R&R two front tires to bring it up that little.

[Dave]

Got some 215/60/15's for the front, didn't really look too bad, but it just brought up the front waaay too much. So I swapped those to the back and put some 205/60/15's up front. It did bring it up a bit and it looks okay. Doesn't look like I'm ready to go mudding now. :eyebrows:

[Vigo]

all the talk about raising the engine is ok, but has anyone else thought of a big skidplate from the radiator support to the k-frame? maybe open a bit at the rear to help airflow out of the engine bay, but ive thought of this on MANY occasions and never have i thought of raising the engine.

[fargo59]

a belly pan in a sense? might be an idea, as long as you allow for airflow. might even help for mileage