I Fixed our crappy distributor caps... [Archive]

rbryant

01-03-2007, 01:30 AM

I have been annoyed with our distributor caps and the usage of the spade terminals for a while now.

I would rather have the distributor cap wear out than the wire terminals especially when I am using MSD wires! I would also like to be able to simply take my wires off without having to pull the cap.

I contacted a couple of cap manufacturers (who were really both the same company anyway) to see if we could get a socket style cap similar to the '79 omni but in the wide short 86+ version in vain. They said it would be $100k or so to setup a distributor cap so I decided against that....

I decided that the best way to get one was to make one.

Here is what I came up with:

http://rbryant.freeshell.org/distrib/top.jpg

The roughness around the terminals is just sealant.

http://rbryant.freeshell.org/distrib/side.jpg

http://rbryant.freeshell.org/distrib/bot.jpg

The plastic around the terminals will be tighter in subsequent conversions. I believe the bottom left was the last one I did and I got a better and better idea of how much material to remove and how to do it.

This is the prototype so it got a little scratched up and a couple of the holes were enlarged just a little too much. I have the process down now so the next one should be even cleaner.

http://rbryant.freeshell.org/distrib/hei%20cap%20and%20wires.JPG

The only thing that might not be popular is that they will be a 90 degree snap terminal out of the cap rather than a 180. With a 180 terminal the HEI style tower is up too high and a 180 boot doesn't cover the terminal sufficiently. The 90 degree terminal also contacts better because it touches on top side of the terminal aswell rather than just a loose fit around it like a sparkplug.

Let me know if you are interested in one of these I plan on making these part of my MSD wire setup if there is interest. Once the spade style terminal sets are gone I don't plan on building anymore wires sets that way.

-Rich

Reaper1

01-03-2007, 02:13 AM

What did you do? Take out terminals from another type of cap and epoxy them in to our cap? I like what I see, just wondering what exactly was done to come up this it.

rbryant

01-03-2007, 03:10 AM

That is pretty much it. Finding the right combination of parts is a pain though.

-Rich

turbovanman²

01-03-2007, 04:27 AM

Not bad at all Rich, :thumb:

GLHS592

01-03-2007, 08:28 AM

That's nothing. I fixed my crappy distributor over a year ago. :lol:
http://www.turbo-mopar.com/forums/photopost/data/500/medium/SC_ENGINE1031.JPG

stargazer7467

01-03-2007, 11:51 AM

thats a real nice setup, howd you do it? Those look like GM coils.

rbryant

01-03-2007, 12:30 PM

Kevin,

That is nice, but I am using stock electronics not aftermarket SDS efi.

My setup should help the vast majority of people that are using the stock electronics.

-Rich

Frank

01-03-2007, 12:58 PM

Rich,
If you think about selling these to the general public, let me know, I will most definently do a trade with you for vendor stat. ;) hehehehe

Frank

rbryant

01-03-2007, 05:02 PM

All,

I need to check the wire lengths before finalizing all of the wire sets but...

I will be selling these both privately and through Turbos Unleashed. I am working with Frank on my limited vender status.

They will be $45 for the wires for another week then moving to $55 for either the stock type or the HEI type wires.

The cap and rotor will be another $35.

It will be another $10 for shipping and handling if you order from me (I need to get boxes, etc).

So either let me know through PM if you want a set or work with Chris @ TU for these and all of your other needs.

-Rich

Tony Hanna

01-03-2007, 10:23 PM

That's pretty slick. I've been kicking around the idea of trying to build a cap like that for awhile, but it just ended up being another one of those projects I never found time for.
Nice work.:thumb:

PentastarTurbo

01-04-2007, 01:23 AM

That turned out pretty slick, now thats thinking outside of the box!

Are those insert pieces in th cap for the wires your using just adapted over from the 85 and older style caps?

rbryant

01-04-2007, 01:35 AM

That turned out pretty slick, now thats thinking outside of the box!

Are those pieces your using just adapted over from the 85 and older style caps?

Thanks!

No they are unique... the older style VW 1.7 caps that work with 85 and older electronics are a socket type:

http://rbryant.freeshell.org/distrib/79%20Omni%20Distrib.jpg

My orignal thought was to do just that but they mold the plastic around the sockets so there is no way to insert them... Because of that the HEI terminals work much better for the modification.

Unless everyone changes their cals to use 85 style distributors (never looked into what that would take or how much worse they function) this is the best option I could come up with.

-Rich

Charger R/T

01-06-2007, 10:24 PM

All,

It will be another $10 for shipping and handling if you order from me (I need to get boxes, etc).

-Rich
I use to get free boxes from the post office. Go to their site and register and they send you priority boxes, tape, and labels to your house for free. If your registered on ebay log in and search for the link to the post office and get your free priority boxes shipped to your house with cool ebay logos on them.
Tim

rbryant

01-09-2007, 06:40 PM

Only one more day to order the wires @ the intro price of $45...

I have several sets of wires and distributors caps built now so I can ship them right away!

Wires, distributor cap, and rotor all for $80 plus shipping. After tomorrow they will be $90 plus shipping!

-Rich

butchsuppe

01-09-2007, 11:00 PM

Your set was install on a car at the last SoCal meeting, not too shaby. Everyone agreed though a straight boot would be nice.

rbryant

01-10-2007, 02:05 AM

Thanks for the feedback!

I would have used a 180 degree terminal if it would have worked. I am actually happy with the 90 degree setup at this point.

There are a bunch of problems with using straight boots:

Because the terminals stick up above the cap the terminal doesn't go down inside of the cap and therefore a regular boot isn't long enough to cover the terminal.

Using a spark plug boot would be 180 BUT they are too small to go over the diff without being streached.

The 90 degree terminals are a better contact because they touch on the top side and are snug where a 180 clip really doesn't clip as tightly.

The 90 degree terminals are much less likely to pull off from the wires even if abused because the force to remove them is not in the opposite direction of the crimp. (this along with the double crimp on the spark plug terminal makes the wires very tough)

John Neff

01-17-2007, 12:49 PM

Just got mine today and I must say Rich. Its looks like its made right from the factory. You did a good job putting this together and I'm sure it will work well with my set-up for my GLH.
I'll add it to my following.

1)RICH "RBRYANT Distributor cap"/ MSD 8.5mm Super Conductor Wires
2)Fireball HI-6 Series Performance Ignition
3)Fireball Performance Ignition Coil
4)Fireball Retard & Map Sensor
5)Mallory 2.2 Unilite Electronic Ignition Distributor Series 37

THNX Rich, It looks great and it will work well.

John Neff

rbryant

01-21-2007, 10:28 PM

In case there is any confusion, the standard spade type terminals will work on a regular 85 distributor cap.

As another option is to make them to use a 79 omni 1.7l distributor cap which is compatible with the 85 electronics (plug and play) and available via special order from pretty much any parts store. This allows the use of a standard distributor terminal rather than a spade. Just let me know what you refer.

GLHS377

02-09-2007, 01:35 PM

Frank

02-09-2007, 02:06 PM

Mine arrived last weekend and look awesome. I can't wait to install!

rbryant

02-09-2007, 03:39 PM

that's awesome. i was going to switch to megasquirt just so i could go coil on plug. this looks like a major improvement for the stock setup. and it'll work well in the interim. I'm pretty firmly rooted in the belief that a lot fo the high-rpm breakeup we see is from the distributor cap. doing dyno runs on brand new plugs, magnecor wires, coil and a cap/rotor, i'd still get breakup. good job! i'm waiting...

I also believe that the MSD wires are far better than the other wires you mention. This solution gives you both MSD wires and an improved distributor cap contact.

No need to wait I have several sets in stock.

They are $90 for the and matching modified HEI style cap.
If you prefer I also offer the stock style MSD wires for $55 plus shipping.

That means that you can have the custom setup for an even $100 shipped to the US or $105 to canada...

Or the stock style for $60 in the US or $62 to canada.

oh wait, what epoxy do you use? seeign that that's kindof my speacialty..
-jason

I would rather not say what material I am using to hold the terminals in place. :) Lets just say that it won't have any trouble working in an automotive environment or any trouble holding the terminals in place.

-Rich

rbryant

02-09-2007, 03:41 PM

Mine arrived last weekend and look awesome. I can't wait to install!

Great!

Please let everyone know how they work for you. We already have them on a few cars with great results. It should be a 10 minute or less job to install them!!

-Rich

GLHS377

02-09-2007, 03:42 PM

that's cool. i was just curious, i thought i might be able to point you in the dirrection of a possibly better and less expensive alternative. cause i'm pretty connected in the composites/epoxy world. that's cool. i'll prolly order one soon, need to get the paint off this thing first.. still +1 for a cool product!
-jason

rbryant

03-07-2007, 02:22 AM

Since noone has posted pictures of their converted cap and MSD wires installed here is my own.

http://rbryant.freeshell.org/msd_wires/msd-wires-87glhs147.jpg

As you can see the 90 degree bends are clearly not a problem and still look very nice! This is on an lbody with a Monster Radiator so there really are no clearance issues.

I have several sets in stock if anyone likes what they see. :)

-Rich

PentastarTurbo

03-07-2007, 02:58 AM

rbryant

03-07-2007, 03:32 AM

Whats that insulated deal running next to the valve cover?
(charge piping?)

I like your setup, thats one hell of a radiator... :thumb:

Intercooler pipe to TB. :)

Now if I can find a way to put a 2.4 in there since I am getting annoyed with the 8 Valve...

-Rich

tryingbe

03-07-2007, 05:32 PM

You just need to be Richer.

CSXT802

03-23-2007, 04:31 PM

Just got my cap, wires and rotor. Every thing looks top notch. Fast shipping, 2 days it was at my door. Thanks for the good service Rich. I'll report back on how it works. Plug gap will tell the tail. :thumb:

CSXT802

03-29-2007, 07:31 PM

This is one of the best mods you can do for your TD. My car has never run as smooth as it does with this set up. the resistance dorp of the MSD wires alone are worth it. I had Magnacore wires on before this and I'll never go back. When I checked the Magnacore wires with my Fluke meter they all showed 1.6-2.1k ohms. the MSD showed 50-60 ohms and 107 ohms for the long coil wire. :thumb:

shelby zed

03-29-2007, 09:33 PM

ill be fixing mine soon like that... mmmm distributorless with msd 8.5 mm wires

rbryant

04-06-2007, 03:56 AM

For those of you that despise red I have just made a new batch of the wires in black. I will post some pictures this weekend as it is much too late tonight.

They look just like the red ones except the wires are black. I am actually surprised at how nice they look in black with gray MSD lettering and the gray plug boots!

So if you wanted a set of MSD wires but just couldn't stomach the red wires like some people have told me then here you go. :)

-Rich

R/T

04-16-2007, 08:06 AM

Hey Rich;

Will the wires reach waaaay up top on a Neon 16v conversion???

There's clearance issues between the dist and the 16v head, 90* terminals would be just the ticket.... ;)

rbryant

04-16-2007, 12:51 PM

Hey Rich;

Will the wires reach waaaay up top on a Neon 16v conversion???

There's clearance issues between the dist and the 16v head, 90* terminals would be just the ticket.... ;)

The 8V ones aren't long enough but I can make them in custom lengths.

The main issue is that I need to source neon style Hemi plug boots so that they fit correctly on the valve cover.

Are the Hemi style plug boots for the Neon, TIII, and Masi heads all pretty much the same?

Thanks,

Rich

87glhs232

04-16-2007, 09:00 PM

Sweet...red wires was my hang up on this. I'll be ordering a cap/rotor/wire set soon.

iTurbo

04-17-2007, 02:05 AM

I would be interested in a custom cap with custom length wires for a TIII head. Not sure about the lengths though as it will be a while before it's mocked up.

rbryant

04-17-2007, 03:22 AM

I would be interested in a custom cap with custom length wires for a TIII head. Not sure about the lengths though as it will be a while before it's mocked up.

Ok I will look into getting some DOHC plug boots. I know they are out there. :)

-Rich

lancer402

04-18-2007, 10:49 PM

Rich

R/T told me about this today and I'm in for a set for a 16v neon hybrid engine, also. I'll be waiting to see what you can find.

thanks,:lol:

ANdy

rbryant

04-19-2007, 02:00 AM

Rich

R/T told me about this today and I'm in for a set for a 16v neon hybrid engine, also. I'll be waiting to see what you can find.

thanks,:lol:

ANdy

Ok I will probably need this for myself eventually anyway. :)

I have a couple of inquiries out to suppliers to see what I can get. I expect that the boots will be more expensive than the 8V setup so I will have to adjust the pricing based on that. Hopefully they won't be too much more than the MSD boots which are already pricey.

-Rich

rbryant

04-19-2007, 01:31 PM

Ok I will probably need this for myself eventually anyway. :)

I have a couple of inquiries out to suppliers to see what I can get. I expect that the boots will be more expensive than the 8V setup so I will have to adjust the pricing based on that. Hopefully they won't be too much more than the MSD boots which are already pricey.

-Rich

Let me know when you want them. I have a source for the plug boots. It will probalby be about $10-$15 more than the 8V setup making them ~65-70 assuming that the wires themselves are probably longer in order to get up over the intake to the center of the valve cover and the boots are more expensive...

-Rich

WVRampage

05-04-2007, 09:20 PM

Hey Rich;

Will the wires reach waaaay up top on a Neon 16v conversion???

There's clearance issues between the dist and the 16v head, 90* terminals would be just the ticket.... ;)

Im noticing the same thing Right now and your set up seams to be whats needed.let us know what you come up with.

rbryant

05-06-2007, 03:37 AM

Im noticing the same thing Right now and your set up seams to be whats needed.let us know what you come up with.

Ok I ordered the boots I just need some measurements for the lengths.

A member is supposed to get this info to me but it might be nice if you also had some measurements.

Just send me a PM if you have everything setup and get some measurements. Just measure out of the cap @ 90 degrees and then loop the wire up around and end the measurement in the center of the plug hole on the top of the valve cover. A long coil wire would work well for this.

Let me know what intake and head you are using so I can compare everyone's measurements.

Thanks,

Rich

WVRampage

05-06-2007, 02:15 PM

Ill let you know in a faw days,Its a 2.2 with a SOHC neon head just as a heads up.

rbryant

05-16-2007, 12:59 AM

All,

I am doing a giveaway on boostedmopar.com as my contribution to that site.

I will be giving a modified distributor cap and a set of 8V HEI wires away to a lucky winner.

Here is the link:

http://boostedmopar.com/forums/showthread.php?t=9816

Check it out and pick your number before they are all gone!

Thanks,

Rich

rbryant

05-30-2007, 09:04 PM

moparfwdsleeper

06-01-2007, 03:17 AM

Just wanted to say thanks to Rich, Kevin and Frank. I can't wait to see the setup in person!

Thanks to all three of you for the best damn give away ive been part of!
Thanks -Clayton

rbryant

06-19-2007, 02:05 PM

All,

We had an anonymous donor pay for a second set of wires to give away!

So here is one more chance to get a free set. There are only a couple of days left so don't delay!

http://boostedmopar.com/forums/showthread.php?t=10251

-Rich

badandy

06-19-2007, 05:55 PM

I'll take #152. I signed up but it won't let me post yet?

rbryant

06-19-2007, 06:41 PM

I'll take #152. I signed up but it won't let me post yet?

Perhaps you haven't responded to a verification email or someting.

The only way to claim a number is to post there.

Sorry but that is the only way it is fair.

-Rich

ForzaV12

07-11-2007, 11:17 AM

Your set was install on a car at the last SoCal meeting, not too shaby. Everyone agreed though a straight boot would be nice.

That was my car(pic in my sig) they were installed on over 6months ago. I think it was Chris's first set. Just thought I'd let you know they are still working well. (not that my car gets driven too much, though!)

rbryant

07-11-2007, 12:27 PM

That was my car(pic in my sig) they were installed on over 6months ago. I think it was Chris's first set. Just thought I'd let you know they are still working well. (not that my car gets driven too much, though!)

Glad to hear that you are happy with them. I believe you got the first set that was actually sold. I had made one other prototype at the time.

From the above comment are the 90 degree boots holding anyone back from purchasing them?

I really think 90 is better since the terminal is less likely to pull off when removed and makes a tighter connection! ;) If people have real heartache with it I can look into longer straight boots again.

I can also make hybrid wires if anyone needs a set of those!

Let me know,

-Rich

Reaper1

07-11-2007, 01:23 PM

I too am VERY happy with my purchase!

I even reinstalled the little platic sheild over the distributor when I got it all done(going for as stealthy as I can). I had to modify it a little, but nothing major or detrimental to its function. If you have a pure show car that this would *HAVE* to be on and in tact, it wouldn't fit. Some tasteful trimming though...not an issue!

Thanks again for a GREAT product!!!

badandy

07-11-2007, 02:32 PM

Glad to hear that you are happy with them. I believe you got the first set that was actually sold. I had made one other prototype at the time.

From the above comment are the 90 degree boots holding anyone back from purchasing them?

I really think 90 is better since the terminal is less likely to pull off when removed and makes a tighter connection! ;) If people have real heartache with it I can look into longer straight boots again.

I can also make hybrid wires if anyone needs a set of those!

Let me know,

-Rich

Yes, the 90 deg. boots are stopping me from purchasing...as well as what about replacement caps? if I'm going to spend that much I want some spares for "just in case"

rbryant

07-11-2007, 04:53 PM

Yes, the 90 deg. boots are stopping me from purchasing...as well as what about replacement caps? if I'm going to spend that much I want some spares for "just in case"

Replacement caps aren't a big deal. I have 9 in stock and make them as a run out and will sell them as replacements without the wires.

$35 for the aluminum center ones, $45 for the all brass cap same price as with the wires.

-Rich

rbryant

07-19-2007, 03:38 PM

All,

In order to meet the constant requests for straight boots on the conversion cap wires I came up with a solution.

I now offer a extended length boot that covers the terminal. It also holds the terminal so that it is strong and prevents the terminal from pulling off.

Bdandy has the prototype set and should recieve it in a couple of days. He has promised to post pictures and write a review!

They will be $65 a set for the straight boots as opposed to $55 for the 90 degree boots since they are much harder to assemble and cost me more.

I also have pictures but haven't downloaded them from the camera yet. I will post them in the next couple of days.

I have everything in stock so let me know if you want a set!

Thanks,

Rich

rbryant

07-21-2007, 04:47 PM

Attaching

Pictures of 180 Boots.

-Rich

moparfwdsleeper

07-21-2007, 04:54 PM

They arent causing any clearance issues on my engine. and they look great.

rbryant

07-21-2007, 05:05 PM

They arent causing any clearance issues on my engine. and they look great.

Yea I like the 90s since they are even less likely to pull off but some people really want the straight ones so I made them.

The straight ones are much more expensive and harder for me to install so they will have a premium cost.

-Rich

WVRampage

07-21-2007, 06:09 PM

I got some preliminary measurements for you of 23 inches it looks like.Ill give you some beter measurments when I get to build the engine.

rbryant

07-24-2007, 11:51 AM

I got some preliminary measurements for you of 23 inches it looks like.Ill give you some beter measurments when I get to build the engine.

Which engine is this for?

I did do a hybrid setup for someone but I think the wires were only about 19" long. This was a 2.0/2.4 head running on a 2.2/2.5 with stock distributor.

Just let me know what you need and we can work something out.

-Rich

WVRampage

07-24-2007, 05:59 PM

2.2 with a SOHC neon head and stock distributer.Ill measure more later and give you an exact.

rbryant

07-24-2007, 08:20 PM

2.2 with a SOHC neon head and stock distributer.Ill measure more later and give you an exact.

Ok I don't have SOHC neon plug boots in stock since that is a rare one. I will see what I can dig up.

Going with a Magnum head? I looked at that option briefly but decided it really wouldn't save me any space on the front side of the engine so I went with a 2.4 longblock instead.

-Rich

WVRampage

07-24-2007, 09:48 PM

regular head for now,Im doing an experiment at first.

badandy

07-25-2007, 12:13 AM

Alrighty...

I just got back from vacation in Vegas:eyebrows: and found my cap/rotor/wires waiting on me:amen: I love getting parts in the mail...it's like a mini christmas...lol.

Okay...on to the skinny

What I removed was Magnacore's with a brass buttoned cap/brass rotor button and a accell coil (I know....booo badAndy). I installed Rich's supplied kit along with an MSD epoxy coil and I must admit I am impressed:thumb:

All the pieces look great IMO. The cap looks modded...but just barely. If you didn't know what you were looking for you would never know! The wires appear to be professionally assembled and were extremely sturdy. The rotor button appears to be a good quality piece. Okay, back to the wires for a moment. I love the straight boots! They are taller and a little tighter than what I am used to seeing. I really like this because when you push them on the cap you get a very authoritative "click"....these baby's ain't going anywhere! Also, with the increased length of the straight boots it seems to help the wires stay away from one another which in theory should keep them from transferring spark energy to one another. I doubt this would be a problem...especially with the MSD wires...but every little precaution helps right? Overall I just think it looks more professional myself...others opinions may vary. I give the setup an A+ for fit and finish.

On to the test drive...

Honestly, the car does seem to feel much more smooth. I did have a suspect coil wire previously as I converted over to the epoxy coil setup beforehand and had to make a coil wire for the meantime until this kit arrived. I did not have any arching before but admittedly if I grabbed the coil wire it would light me up! I didn't have any drive-ability issues before the swap...but after it does seem to idle better and seems to accelerate more smoothly. I'm sure this is nothing the butt-o-meter could register and it could be just that "piece of mind" feeling you get sometimes...but that makes it worth it to me.

I'll follow up with some pics and my take on more long term everyday driving with the setup in the next few days.

iTurbo

07-25-2007, 02:39 AM

rbryant

07-25-2007, 03:11 AM

Can you do custom wire sets? I'd still like to get a cap/wires combo, but it would be for a regular commonblock with stock distributor and TIII head. Would you need the engine on hand to do a mock-up, or could I just provide you with specs somehow? I'd prefer it if the wires ran around the side of the block and entered the head through the side (like stock TIII), rather than up and over the valve cover (unsightly IMO). Let me know, thanks.

I can do custom sets. In reality all of my wires are custom sets!

We will have to work out a price depending on what the final specs are but we can work it out.

The best way to do this is to take an old coil wire and mock up the length against it and then have me match that.

I have done a Hybrid wireset this way with good results.

Lets take it to a PM and we can work out the details.

Thanks,

Rich

lancer402

07-28-2007, 10:37 AM

Rich

Sorry for the delay in getting back to you. I have put about 5000 miles on the cap, rotor and wires since I installed them about 1.5 months ago. The cap and wire set for my hybrid works great! I used to feel a few misses at 16 psi boost but now its smooth to 20 psi. I might be able to open up the spark gap more.

I think we decided on 18" for all for plug wires or it may have been 17" But you could make them 1" shorter than you did. Also the longer coil wire isnt needed.

Many thanks for a nice job.

Andy

Dez

09-21-2007, 03:02 PM

So, where are all the pictures at?

rbryant

09-21-2007, 03:14 PM

So, where are all the pictures at?

Which would you like to see?

Here are the hybrid wires which aren't shown in the thread:

5787

Here is another shot of the 180 red wires:

5788

-Rich

Dez

09-21-2007, 04:16 PM

Cool, any customer pictures?

rbryant

09-21-2007, 04:19 PM

Cool, any customer pictures?

I don't actually have any good customer pictures.

It would be great if people added them to the thread and gave their impressions.

-Rich

WVRampage

03-12-2008, 08:40 PM

I just got mine installed and they are great,I think that will out perform the magnacores that were on there.

1984rampage

03-12-2008, 09:45 PM

What exactly do these do for the car? Sorry for the question Im learning.

moparzrule

03-16-2008, 08:50 PM

Well first it allows you to ba able to take the plug wires out without taking the cap off, stupid stock design. But secondly and most importantly, the stock design the plug wire has a metal end that slips through into the cap. So, the rotor actually transfers the spark directly to the plug wire. At first thought, it sounds like a good thing, but it's not because after just a few thousand miles the plug wire end glazes over and starts to not have as good of a contact. Then you start loosing the strength of the spark.

rbryant

03-16-2008, 10:04 PM

Thanks Chris,

As Chris stated one of the important things is that it is better to have your distributor cap wear out than your high dollar wires.

With stock cap and wires it doesn't matter much since they are cheap but it gets expensive after a while if you constantly have to change your wires out.

The other issue is that our caps really don't have room for 8.5mm and larger wires. This gives a better method for using them and also gives smaller brass terminals for more precise spark control.

-Rich